CW in the UK

[Ratheiser]

Hi folks,

My wife and I are planning our vacation this year in the UK. Since we are always accompanied by our 'Czechies', we were wondering about the latest news regarding the status of our breed.

Can anyone of you guys help us with some relevant information?

Looking foreward to receiving a response from native Brits.

Greetings,

Gershom (Netherlands)

[tikaani]

Originally Posted by Ratheiser

Hi folks,

My wife and I are planning our vacation this year in the UK. Since we are always accompanied by our 'Czechies', we were wondering about the latest news regarding the status of our breed.

Can anyone of you guys help us with some relevant information?

Looking foreward to receiving a response from native Brits.

Greetings,

Gershom (Netherlands)

no need to worrie about the law her regarding CWD as they are now leagal to own over here. im not sure on the quarentine though so u should probably ask your vet about that.
here is a link to the defra site that explains the law over here. hope it helps
The link below takes you to a webpage which has recently been amended to reflect how CWD etc are to be treated under the Dangerous Wild Animals Act.
http://www.defra.gov.uk/wildlife-countryside/protection/dwaa/hybrid.htm

[Ratheiser]

Hi,

Thanks for the info. I shall, therefore, contact our vet.

Greetings,

Gershom

[Navajo]

No requirement for quarantine under the PETS scheme.

http://www.defra.gov.uk/animalh/quar...res/owners.htm

[Ratheiser]

Hi,

Thanks for the information.

Greetings,

Gershom

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by Ratheiser

Hi folks,

My wife and I are planning our vacation this year in the UK. Since we are always accompanied by our 'Czechies', we were wondering about the latest news regarding the status of our breed.

Can anyone of you guys help us with some relevant information?

Looking foreward to receiving a response from native Brits.

Greetings,

Gershom (Netherlands)

hi Gershom, i sent you email regarding what to do, if there is anything else you are unsure of mail me or use phone number i give you in case of any problems while in uk, regards paul

[Ratheiser]

Hi Paul,

Thanks ever so much for your kind offer. I shall cetrainly get in contact with you if need be.

Greetings and thanks again,

Gershom

[Jolanda]

Originally Posted by tikaani

no need to worrie about the law her regarding CWD as they are now leagal to own over here.

The link below takes you to a webpage which has recently been amended to reflect how CWD etc are to be treated under the Dangerous Wild Animals Act.
http://www.defra.gov.uk/wildlife-countryside/protection/dwaa/hybrid.htm

Wow, that's great news! Finally!

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by Jolanda

Wow, that's great news! Finally!

it is great news it only took us just over 6 years to get the law changed but still not bad for just a few people working very hard and getting a law amended, we have just had our third litter of CWD mum and pups are fine, regards pacino

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by solowolf

it is great news it only took us just over 6 years to get the law changed but still not bad for just a few people working very hard and getting a law amended, we have just had our third litter of CWD mum and pups are fine, regards pacino

Yes it is good work by you all ho did work whit this
But can you tell me way the puppys are not to be pure by FCI or Wolfdog.org ???
That part I do not understand if the puppys now is pure by DEFRA way not by FCI ???

Best Regards / Mikael

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by Mikael

Yes it is good work by you all ho did work whit this
But can you tell me way the puppys are not to be pure by FCI or Wolfdog.org ???
That part I do not understand if the puppys now is pure by DEFRA way not by FCI ???

Best Regards / Mikael

work carried out for the law change was done by my wife and i, mrs Andre Tanner, and about 6 other people, and big thanks to Koos and Letty who give us lots of nessesary information on the breed to make up the paperwork we needed.
the puppies in uk once all paperwork is supplied to kennel club will have uk pedigrees, and therefor we could show in Europe, defra are only the ministry who inforce the law for the government, so now they have amended the law it is ok with them, they are nothing to do with registering the dogs, this is for the kennel club, who will now register our dogs as the law has changed, as for the FCI,, here in uk well nobody is sure about anything, they say we are part of Europe but still our friends can not visit with there dogs unless they have passports??? the uk is still living in the past and has island mentality, sad but true,, as you may have noticed the uk breeders are no longer on wolfdog.org , so at present there is not much point in putting any info as to what we are breeding, it all stems form cross breeedings by people, my point is when anyone with a labrador crosses it with a poodle you dont get the lab clubs or poodle clubs up in arms about it, there are so many cross bred dogs now in uk and rest of the world, but people on wolfdog .org come down hard on people in uk who cross bred there cwd, the difference in uk is they can not register such cross breds, we know lots have been registered in southern Europe as we can see from photos on wolfdog.org or if we attend shows. I my self will never cross a cwd with another breed of dog, I will however use a pure wolf , again i am condemed on wolfdog.org?? so i take it only people like Karl Hartle and MR Saarloos are the only people who should do such things? well sorry but its a free world for all to do as they please, so why do i breed such wolfdogs, i breed them as i want to see how much i can keep them looking like a wolf with selective breeding with many friends in uk and Europe, breeding without massive inbreeding all our animals are health checked not just breeding stock, but this is my private thing and has nothing to do with my pure cwd breeding, i have all my cwd bitchs on pet passports and i do travel to Europe to breed my cwd, i offered to buy a cwd recently of the rehoming list on wolfdog.org it would have been nice to get new line to uk to help us, my friends in Europe who translated for me said sorry paul the guy wont sell to the u.k., this is result of the people on wolfdog.org who have said we are only cross breeders and even for just money, this is my 3rd litter in 7 years, yet other breeders have breed more than me in 1 yr but they seem to be o.k.? and they do keep useing the same stud dogs??? there is artical soon in uk dog mag, it will state that at present i will not forward papers to kennel club as i want some assurences that our club will controll breedings and dogs eligable to be registered, my fear is the show world people, i have nothing against people who show there dogs, but i do not agree with because a dog is a champion it should be used on every bitch around or the bitch be used to breed of every season,, you can see examples of every breed on the planet where there are champion dogs that people will say how did that ever become a champion,, this is when the trouble can begin as people who are not educated on breeding dogs will just want to use the dog because it has champion status,, there is an ever incresing difference between the cwd bred in northern Europe to those bred elsewhere and it can be seen on the photos on wolfdog.org, as we can also see more posts over the years on different new health problems, so therefor it is best to try and get new owners even pet owners to health check there dogs, this will of coarse be hard to do, but not impossable, as for me breeding and selling for money, if i have sold a cwd in uk, the new owners may be on the site, if they have contact mail or phone ask them how easy it was to get a cwd from me,,, every person has to visit me, they have to go hands on with my dogs, they will recieve a fact sheet, they are asked lots of questions and then i or a friend will visit to see they have been telling me the truth as to where they live and the facilities they have for the dog, out of every 10 people who visit and want a cwd on average only 2 in my personal opinion will be suitable owners,so i do care where my pups go and i do take more care than most breeders, if one of these people break there contract they signed not to cross breed, and they do,then it does not make me irresponsable as many have made out on this site,,, you can only take people as you find them and take there word, one last thing for all the people who have give my wife and i and others so much abuse just remember if you ever come to visit the uk, my wife and I, Andre,Koos and Letty and others for many years fought to get the law changed so you can all walk your CWD here without any problems and in future even attend dog shows.... best regards Mr P Winder breeeder of PURE CWD.

inbreeding, health problems,registered cross bred dogs,SO WHAT ARE YOU ALL DOING ABOUT IT??? Our question for Europe from U.K.??????/

[Juniorwolf]

Originally Posted by solowolf

work carried out for the law change was done by my wife and i, mrs Andre Tanner, and about 6 other people, and big thanks to Koos and Letty who give us lots of nessesary information on the breed to make up the paperwork we needed.
the puppies in uk once all paperwork is supplied to kennel club will have uk pedigrees, and therefor we could show in Europe, defra are only the ministry who inforce the law for the government, so now they have amended the law it is ok with them, they are nothing to do with registering the dogs, this is for the kennel club, who will now register our dogs as the law has changed, as for the FCI,, here in uk well nobody is sure about anything, they say we are part of Europe but still our friends can not visit with there dogs unless they have passports??? the uk is still living in the past and has island mentality, sad but true,, as you may have noticed the uk breeders are no longer on wolfdog.org , so at present there is not much point in putting any info as to what we are breeding, it all stems form cross breeedings by people, my point is when anyone with a labrador crosses it with a poodle you dont get the lab clubs or poodle clubs up in arms about it, there are so many cross bred dogs now in uk and rest of the world, but people on wolfdog .org come down hard on people in uk who cross bred there cwd, the difference in uk is they can not register such cross breds, we know lots have been registered in southern Europe as we can see from photos on wolfdog.org or if we attend shows. I my self will never cross a cwd with another breed of dog, I will however use a pure wolf , again i am condemed on wolfdog.org?? so i take it only people like Karl Hartle and MR Saarloos are the only people who should do such things? well sorry but its a free world for all to do as they please, so why do i breed such wolfdogs, i breed them as i want to see how much i can keep them looking like a wolf with selective breeding with many friends in uk and Europe, breeding without massive inbreeding all our animals are health checked not just breeding stock, but this is my private thing and has nothing to do with my pure cwd breeding, i have all my cwd bitchs on pet passports and i do travel to Europe to breed my cwd, i offered to buy a cwd recently of the rehoming list on wolfdog.org it would have been nice to get new line to uk to help us, my friends in Europe who translated for me said sorry paul the guy wont sell to the u.k., this is result of the people on wolfdog.org who have said we are only cross breeders and even for just money, this is my 3rd litter in 7 years, yet other breeders have breed more than me in 1 yr but they seem to be o.k.? and they do keep useing the same stud dogs??? there is artical soon in uk dog mag, it will state that at present i will not forward papers to kennel club as i want some assurences that our club will controll breedings and dogs eligable to be registered, my fear is the show world people, i have nothing against people who show there dogs, but i do not agree with because a dog is a champion it should be used on every bitch around or the bitch be used to breed of every season,, you can see examples of every breed on the planet where there are champion dogs that people will say how did that ever become a champion,, this is when the trouble can begin as people who are not educated on breeding dogs will just want to use the dog because it has champion status,, there is an ever incresing difference between the cwd bred in northern Europe to those bred elsewhere and it can be seen on the photos on wolfdog.org, as we can also see more posts over the years on different new health problems, so therefor it is best to try and get new owners even pet owners to health check there dogs, this will of coarse be hard to do, but not impossable, as for me breeding and selling for money, if i have sold a cwd in uk, the new owners may be on the site, if they have contact mail or phone ask them how easy it was to get a cwd from me,,, every person has to visit me, they have to go hands on with my dogs, they will recieve a fact sheet, they are asked lots of questions and then i or a friend will visit to see they have been telling me the truth as to where they live and the facilities they have for the dog, out of every 10 people who visit and want a cwd on average only 2 in my personal opinion will be suitable owners,so i do care where my pups go and i do take more care than most breeders, if one of these people break there contract they signed not to cross breed, and they do,then it does not make me irresponsable as many have made out on this site,,, you can only take people as you find them and take there word, one last thing for all the people who have give my wife and i and others so much abuse just remember if you ever come to visit the uk, my wife and I, Andre,Koos and Letty and others for many years fought to get the law changed so you can all walk your CWD here without any problems and in future even attend dog shows.... best regards Mr P Winder breeeder of PURE CWD.

inbreeding, health problems,registered cross bred dogs,SO WHAT ARE YOU ALL DOING ABOUT IT??? Our question for Europe from U.K.??????/

I guess this is the reason why your dogs are not present at WD.org :

Originally Posted by WolfWhistle

In Sweden a dog will not lose its pedigree if you use it in mix-breeding. But you as a breeder might lose your kennel name and be "banned" by the Swedish kennel Club if you participate in such things. (even though you might "get away" with it the first times...)

Ninni

I am pretty sure that this is FCI-regulations, at least I know these regulations also apply in my country and it does`nt matter if you crossbreed with another breed of dog, a wolf, a jackal or whatever...
it is simply not allowed by FCI approved kennels to crossbreed, I think WD.org try to follow FCI-regulations U.K. or not !

Greetings Rolf

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by rolf

I guess this is the reason why your dogs are not present at WD.org :



I am pretty sure that this is FCI-regulations, at least I know these regulations also apply in my country and it does`nt matter if you crossbreed with another breed of dog, a wolf, a jackal or whatever...
it is simply not allowed by FCI approved kennels to crossbreed, I think WD.org try to follow FCI-regulations U.K. or not !

Greetings Rolf

the uk kennel club have agreement with FCI regarding breeds but they do not come under FCI ruleing nor does any uk breeder, if you register any pup or litter in uk and it is found to be fraudulent you will be banned from kennel club for life, breeding and showing of any dogs, you also loose your kennel name or affix, as we will never be under FCI regulations in uk, is why we keep our own records of all pure bred cwd. and even at that the uk kennel club will welcome any breed recognised by the FCI to compete in shows in uk, as long as they are not on the dangerous dogs listing in which case they are illegal in the u.k. So while wolfdog.org may condem us as we are not under FCI it again is not our fault, but on the other hand we will welcome any European cwd to u.k. and we will respect there FCI pedigree, it is a pity it dosnt work both ways ,, such is life,,,,, not to worry i will still use my friends European dogs to breed from.

P.S. heres a funny thing but tell the moderaters, as people may ask questions, in 2003 my first czech bitch Lynx legend von rijnecker hof was registered with the uk kennel club,,,, her FCI pedigree was asked for and accepted by the uk kennel club,,, so dont believe all you here on wolfdog.org why the breeders have been removed,,,,, they are telling PORKIES AGAIN......her uk kennel club registration even has her FCI reg number on it???????????

[Juniorwolf]

Originally Posted by solowolf

the uk kennel club have agreement with FCI regarding breeds but they do not come under FCI ruleing nor does any uk breeder, if you register any pup or litter in uk and it is found to be fraudulent you will be banned from kennel club for life, breeding and showing of any dogs, you also loose your kennel name or affix, as we will never be under FCI regulations in uk, is why we keep our own records of all pure bred cwd. and even at that the uk kennel club will welcome any breed recognised by the FCI to compete in shows in uk, as long as they are not on the dangerous dogs listing in which case they are illegal in the u.k. So while wolfdog.org may condem us as we are not under FCI it again is not our fault, but on the other hand we will welcome any European cwd to u.k. and we will respect there FCI pedigree, it is a pity it dosnt work both ways ,, such is life,,,,, not to worry i will still use my friends European dogs to breed from.

P.S. heres a funny thing but tell the moderaters, as people may ask questions, in 2003 my first czech bitch Lynx legend von rijnecker hof was registered with the uk kennel club,,,, her FCI pedigree was asked for and accepted by the uk kennel club,,, so dont believe all you here on wolfdog.org why the breeders have been removed,,,,, they are telling PORKIES AGAIN......her uk kennel club registration even has her FCI reg number on it???????????

1. this FCI-regulations have nothing to do with if you try to register the dogs or not, it is only about crossbreeding

2. I am sure you are not condemed for not being under FCI-regulations, as it is not necessary to be under FCI regulations to follow the regulations of FCI, commen sense, good moral and ethics

3. no one at WD.org told me this, this is just my own thoughts

I really don`t see what Lynx legend von rijnecker hof or her registration have to do with all of this ? ...unless you did crossbreed her
....maybe I am wrong ???

Greetings Rolf

[solowolf]

Originally Posted by rolf

1. this FCI-regulations have nothing to do with if you try to register the dogs or not, it is only about crossbreeding

2. I am sure you are not condemed for not being under FCI-regulations, as it is not necessary to be under FCI regulations to follow the regulations of FCI, commen sense, good moral and ethics

3. no one at WD.org told me this, this is just my own thoughts

I really don`t see what Lynx legend von rijnecker hof or her registration have to do with all of this ? ...unless you did crossbreed her
....maybe I am wrong ???

Greetings Rolf

hey Rolf theres me thinking you are different untll you again come up with the smart remark unless you did cross breed her,,, and the little funny face, tell u what hope i see u in europe this year ill give you a funny look on your face you are just like all the others with there smart arse remarks and stupid fu..ing little smilies,

[hanninadina]

Paul, sorry to say, you maybe have cwd which you don´t crossbreed. But you did last year a litter with your Timber wolf and cwd! So what do you want? You compare yourself with Hartle and Saarloos but why did you crossbreed an american wolf with an europaen breed cwd? This is what you be blamed for! I have no problem if you have Timber wolf, american wolfdog or whatever. But please northamerican wolves and wolfdogs are on part and have nothing to do with europaen part! These are totally different "breeds"! If you would have taken a carpartian wolf, I think people would maybe understand you. But so?

And what the hell do you think people think of you after pissing french/netherlands kennel of Cory Kayzer? So if you do crossbreeding, do it, but than you have nothing to expect here in the world of csw on wolfdog.org!

Christian

I love csw, and I love too american wolfdogs. But I never ever would crossbreed europaen wolfdogs with american wolves or wolfdogs although I have a canadian wolfdog!

[Juniorwolf]

Originally Posted by solowolf

hey Rolf theres me thinking you are different untll you again come up with the smart remark unless you did cross breed her,,, and the little funny face, tell u what hope i see u in europe this year ill give you a funny look on your face you are just like all the others with there smart arse remarks and stupid fu..ing little smilies,

Hey Paul,
Sorry, but I really do not see my question as a smart remark ?
For me this smiley is a surpriced face, as I really do not know if you have used her for crossbreeding or not, I really don`t read all topics about you as many of them are not constructive, but only people pointing fingers at eachother, but I really did not see what Lynx had to do with the rest of your answer on my post, so since you mention her, ofcourse I must think she have something to do with crossbreeding ...I don`t know, that`s why I ask

I really don`t see my self as all others, I am an induvidual and I write, think and react as an induvidual, no matter how others write, think or react. It was not my intention to piss you off, but to inform you of what I think could be the reason, why your dogs are not displayed here, as you say your self ....it is just a f..ing smiley

Greetings Rolf

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by solowolf

work carried out for the law change was done by my wife and i, mrs Andre Tanner, and about 6 other people, and big thanks to Koos and Letty who give us lots of nessesary information on the breed to make up the paperwork we needed.
the puppies in uk once all paperwork is supplied to kennel club will have uk pedigrees, and therefor we could show in Europe, defra are only the ministry who inforce the law for the government, so now they have amended the law it is ok with them, they are nothing to do with registering the dogs, this is for the kennel club, who will now register our dogs as the law has changed, as for the FCI,, here in uk well nobody is sure about anything, they say we are part of Europe but still our friends can not visit with there dogs unless they have passports??? the uk is still living in the past and has island mentality, sad but true.

inbreeding, health problems,registered cross bred dogs,SO WHAT ARE YOU ALL DOING ABOUT IT??? Our question for Europe from U.K.??????/

I do think all dogs need passport to pass into a nother country in Europe EU or not ??? it has to do whit deseases like rabies for example

As I anderstand all pure CsV in UK will soon have all papers and be pure CsV in all FCI countrys and by Wolfdog.org to ???

I do try to make a good start for CsV in Sweden whit information about the breed and demands like HD x-ray, but already there is problem and others only wont it to be recomendations not demands

Who has reregestrated CsV cross breeds as you know in Sweden we will atleast not get that problem as it is already DNA test demands for breeding CsV and Saarloos to Skk.

I´m not against cross breeding at all !!! CsV is a cross breed but I think if you mix CsV, Saarloos or Wolf you better be a expert in genetic and cross breeding as it is far from simple, aspesialy to get the puppys into a good and responsible home. It is not many that has the home, time and experience to own a 50% hybrid

I think it is just enough wolfblood in CsV as it is, but that is only my point of view, you have yours

So good luck whit your new breed, best regards / Mikael

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by hanninadina

Paul, sorry to say, you maybe have cwd which you don´t crossbreed. But you did last year a litter with your Timber wolf and cwd! So what do you want? You compare yourself with Hartle and Saarloos but why did you crossbreed an american wolf with an europaen breed cwd? This is what you be blamed for! I have no problem if you have Timber wolf, american wolfdog or whatever. But please northamerican wolves and wolfdogs are on part and have nothing to do with europaen part! These are totally different "breeds"!

Christian

But way not ??? if you cross breed it is better if they have nothing to do whit each other and as many do think me included, Lennart Saarloos did cross in his neighbours Timber Wolf to get the big size and therefore the brown colors in that breed still today

Best regards / Mikael

[hanninadina]

Mikael, Crossbreed means crossing a wolf with a dog! Saarloos people say there is no Timber wolf in Saarloos. The first wolf was a europaen russian wolf which Saarloos took.

It seems that you don´t know much about europaen wolves, do you?! One of the biggest europaen wolf was a carpartian male with 90 cm in shoulder! And the colour? Brown colour, it is the same you find it too by carpartian wolves.

So if I understand you right you would even mix a siberian tiger with an indian tiger, or an indian elephant with an african elephant? Nort american wolves are different. For example they have at least 5 different colours, like black, white, grey, red, brown. Do you find these colours in europaen wolf? No, of course not! Different types but most is grey, with yellow, brown, a bit red, but always look like grey! In grey amercan wolves there are always different colours. They are different from behaviour. Sure for a person like you a wolf is a wolf. Please dream on.

Christian

Crossing a csw with a wolf is not 50 % wolfblood but normally about 65 %. Sure it is mathematics and the case is the F 1 is the main problem. And Paul did sell one of his pups to germany. And it would be not nice if this guy will bring this F 1 in csw population.