Saarloos mixes by "Crying Wolf" kennel (CSV red colored)

[admin]

Short time ago I received interesting message saying that the problem can be not Galiba and his litter mates but his offsprings and other dogs born by CW in that time.

One of the east European breeders wrote me that strange things happened with Galiba. AS reported there were more breeders who covered their females with this dog but ALL the females stayed empty. The ONLY litters (with one exclussion) were born by Crying Wolf. Miracle happend because Galiba was announced as sterile.

Maybe it the explanation... Because "affected" would be Sibir (father of the red dogs in FR) and Volos (father of the Saarloos alike dogs from France). It will be also explanation why the Crying Wolf breeder is so much afraid about the DNA tests. Because it can show that Galiba is not the father of Sibir?

[admin]

So short: what should be checked on the beginning is - if the father of Sibir is really Galiba.

If not than: if the reall father is the Saarloos.

Of yes - than how many CW dogs are sired by the Saarloos living by CW.

[Shadowlands]

So, does that mean that Galiba is the only suspect one from his litter? His litter mates are not in question? I had the impression that it was the parents of Galiba that had to be checked. Sorry for the confusion

Surely someone out there can get the owner of Galiba to help sort this out? Maybe even just one of the owners of his 'reported' offspring - if it was my dog, I would be demanding to know...

[Hanka]

Galiba has normal colour and normal mask. I know him personally and it is normal czech. wolfdog.
His owner is veterinary doctor, she is normal, clever and not blind. If she will have saarlos mix, she will be first, who will ask breeder.....
In time, when Galiba was born, was first saarloses in Evropa very far from breeders of czech. wolfdogs....
So this what you write here about him is nonsens.

[Rona]

Originally Posted by Hanka

Galiba has normal colour and normal mask. I know him personally and it is normal czech. wolfdog.
His owner is veterinary doctor, she is normal, clever and not blind. If she will have saarlos mix, she will be first, who will ask breeder.....
In time, when Galiba was born, was first saarloses in Evropa very far from breeders of czech. wolfdogs....
So this what you write here about him is nonsens.

From what I grasped from the above discussion the problem was connected not with the identity of Galiba, but whether Galiba was the true father of his pups. Should his owner deposit DNA material of Galiba in Laboklin for comparison with the DNA of his offspring (like the owner of Juri ZP did a few months ago) she would solve a lot of problems and show goodwill. Being convinced about the dog's true parenthood and, as you say, being

veterinary doctor, normal, clever and not blind.

she shouldn't have a problem with this. Giving close to 200 owners and many breeders peace of mind is worth a little sample of Galiba's blood! To many people this would be a matter of honour and responsibility.

[Hanka]

Hello Rona,
I will write about my two females, because I don´t want to write about not my dogs. I absolutelly have not reason to distrust, Galiba is grandfather of my females.. Cause I reacted to thread of admin, about "not suspected" Galiba in pedigree of my pups.
But you are right.....From Galiba´s owner can be friendly, if she will give DNA. But I am worry it will not be. I asked her about it for Lorry already....And I was not succesfull.

[Rona]

Originally Posted by Hanka

But you are right.....From Galiba´s owner can be friendly, if she will give DNA. But I am worry it will not be. I asked her about it for Lorry already....And I was not succesfull.

Doesn't such approach worry you at all? It would worry me if I bred on Galiba's descendents... A person who does not want to cooperate in such circumstances apparently has something to hide.

Breeding (unlike puppy making) is not a "private issue" - it's all about responsibility and respect towards dog owners and other breeders.

[BeatriceSlavinschi]

Originally Posted by Hanka

Galiba has normal colour and normal mask. I know him personally and it is normal czech. wolfdog.

I also met brother of Galiba: Gizmo. And he is normal czw also ...

[BeatriceSlavinschi]

Originally Posted by Admin

Maybe it the explanation... Because "affected" would be Sibir (father of the red dogs in FR) and Volos (father of the Saarloos alike dogs from France).

Admin, let me understand ... also Sibir and Volos are suspected of being saarlos mixes, or only their offsprings? Because if they aren't, maybe is the mother of that litters with saarlos genes... ??? As I saw in the database, they have puppies only in France and some of french breeders are known to bred mixes ... right?

[Hanka]

Beatrice, I asked owner of Galiba about help for my friends....

[Morian]

Originally Posted by BeatriceSlavinschi

also Sibir and Volos are suspected of being saarlos mixes, or only their offsprings?

Originally Posted by Admin

The DNA test of the red Wolfdogs were done in France so it is proven that the red puppies are sired by son of Galiba.

i understood that sibir and volos...

[BeatriceSlavinschi]

Originally Posted by Morian

i understood that sibir and volos...

Ok. I understand also that the genetic tests were done on their (Volos and Sibir) offsprings - grandsons of Galiba, not directly on Volos or Sibir, but on their puppies which they sired. So the question was: they produce these puppies by themselves? Wasn't there any females? The red gene is surely from father line or may be from mother line?

[Morian]

as admin said - both parents might be carriers. and they both have galiba in their pedigree. so it would be good to have dna sample of galiba to check is he the father.

[BeatriceSlavinschi]

Originally Posted by Morian

as admin said - both parents might be carriers. and they both have galiba in their pedigree. so it would be good to have dna sample of galiba to check is he the father.

Ok. Now you've knocked me down ... Are you saying that both parents can have Galiba in their pedigrees? Isn't this called inbreeding?
Ok. Now I looked in the database ... and maybe you got my point wrong.
I was saying that for having a litter you need two parents, right? When you said "both parents" I think you are not refering at Volos and Sibir. When I say both parents I say FATHER = Volos or Sibir
MOTHER = one of the females
So my question was: isn't it possible that the red gene to be from the mother's line? I saw there in the database that both Volos and Sibir had puppies with french females. Maybe is in their blood the red gene?
I understand that not Volos and Sibir were tested, but their offsprings with other females. So wouldn't be necessary that females be also tested? How do you know that the red gene is from father's line and is Galiba?

[Morian]

i'm totally lost
parents of red pups were thalia and sibir, and

Originally Posted by Admin

Maybe it the explanation... Because "affected" would be Sibir (father of the red dogs in FR) and Volos (father of the Saarloos alike dogs from France). It will be also explanation why the Crying Wolf breeder is so much afraid about the DNA tests. Because it can show that Galiba is not the father of Sibir?

so as i understand now not only galiba is "doubtful"?? if both parents must be carriers, then it means... falco is their common ancestor, so the question is about him maybe??? is he father of galiba and other cw itters? admin, please, clarify it