CSV Mixes in the US

[draggar]

Originally Posted by solowolf

hi Marcy, it will happen and there is nothing you can do will stop it, money is the goal, my first litter in uk all new owners signed contract that they would never cross breed there CWS with any other breed of dog, they did and it would cost me fortune to take them all to court to get my dogs back as it is classed as civil mater,

QFT on the bold part. Some (unethical?) breeders only car about breeding what is popular and taking in as much cash as they can. We'll see more of this as the breed becomes popular. When we sold our puppies we had similar statements in our contracts. One went to a pet home - it was mandatory he was neutered when he was old enough (he also came with a limited registration so they couldn't show him). The co-own female won't be bred without our consultation (the owner wouldn't do that anyway) and the fully-owned female, while the owner does have the right to breed her how they feel, they will consult us.

But - be glad that it seems that most of the vlcak community has a high set of standards. People who do this will have a hard time falsifying the paperwork (like some other breed clubs).

We know someone who was "training" a Dutch shepherd for close to a year. What did he do? He bred her to one of his malinois and when the litter was born had a very well known trainer falsify paperwork so they could be registered as pure bred malinois. I won't mention any names.

I don't think we'll have this problem in this breed for a while.

[lupis]

Originally Posted by draggar

I don't think we'll have this problem in this breed for a while.

We have. In Italy we have dogs from Passo del Lupo who look exacly like Tamaskans... but in pedigree are CLC.

[miran]

Tamaskan is been breed for looks and behavior.
We all know the CWS behavior and that is not what we want in the Tamaskan. So yes there are breeds that look the same just take the Saarloos.....

I have all three. A saarloos , a CWS and a Tamaskan. I find it unethical to crossbreed this breeds.
It is the difference in behavior that we want in the Tamaskan and you can only reach that if you only use 100% dog. I love real wolfdogs like the CWS and the saarloos but there are peoples that can not handle the behavior and that's why there is the Tamaskan.

It is a big shame that breeders(not real tamaskan breeders) will use a story and try to really crossbreed them with CWS because they do not know what they create, just for the use of selling there litter better. They can not use the standard of a Tamaskan if they use another breed because the easy behavior of the dog will be gone. Just like any CWS,Saarloos and real Tamaskan owner is that where we all fighting against.
So please any CWS or Saarloos owner please please please never let one of your dogs been used for this unethical practise

[draggar]

Originally Posted by miran

Tamaskan is been breed for looks and behavior.
We all know the CWS behavior and that is not what we want in the Tamaskan. So yes there are breeds that look the same just take the Saarloos.....

Every breed has it's reason and purpose and IMO the only acceptable reason to cross breed (any breed) is to create a new breed that fills a gap in the dog world. Breeding cross-breeds for money or just ease IMO is unethical to begin with. "They make good pets" is not a good reason.

Any puppies sold during the "transition" period (while the new breed is being engineered (for the lack of a better term) should all be spayed / neutered when they reach the correct age.

It is a big shame that breeders(not real tamaskan breeders) will use a story and try to really crossbreed them with CWS because they do not know what they create, just for the use of selling there litter better. They can not use the standard of a Tamaskan if they use another breed because the easy behavior of the dog will be gone. Just like any CWS,Saarloos and real Tamaskan owner is that where we all fighting against.
So please any CWS or Saarloos owner please please please never let one of your dogs been used for this unethical practise

No dog (of any breed) should be used for unethical breeding. This is a major issue here in the USA - too many unethical breeders breeding and selling the pups too young (I just saw on another forum someone's family got a puppy - the "last one" from the litter, at 5 weeks - yes, I went off on them), don't require neuter / spay so then these new pet owners can breed "pet" dogs thus contributing to an exploding pet overpopulation.

Luckily, the vlcak breed is still very new in the USA so it can be monitored who gets the puppies and make sure people with the dogs' and breed's best interests in mind as opposed to their own agenda but sadly there WILL be a time when this can no longer be monitored. As the breed becomes more popular (and I know there is a small demand for wolf-hybrids here) more unethical breeders will pop up, just look at how damaged the German shepherd breed is here.

[miran]

Any puppies sold during the "transition" period (while the new breed is being engineered (for the lack of a better term) should all be spayed / neutered when they reach the correct age.

Well not any but yes most. Only not the ones you want to use for using your word the engineering for the breed.

Every breed has it's reason and purpose and IMO the only acceptable reason to cross breed (any breed) is to create a new breed that fills a gap in the dog world. Breeding cross-breeds for money or just ease IMO is unethical to begin with. "They make good pets" is not a good reason.

Besides good pets the breed was original started for a better sled-dog.
I find a pup going to his new home with 5 weeks way to early(at the earliest point I would say 8 weeks and no sooner). And if only used for house-dog I agree with you that it is better that they all be spayed / neutered.

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

As spaying/neutering can have very negative side effects I find this point of view very strange. It means you amputate healthy organs instead of looking for responsible owners.

Ina

[draggar]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

As spaying/neutering can have very negative side effects I find this point of view very strange. It means you amputate healthy organs instead of looking for responsible owners.

Ina

There are health arguments on both sides of the issue but even the most responsible owner can still have accidents or unforseen events. IMO it is better in the log run to take percuations.

Many pets were not spayed or neutered in the Cayman Islands and because of this they had a stray dog population explosion (that's an understatement) after hurricane Ivan went though the island. I'm sure a year (or two) form now we'll see a similar situation in Haiti.