Stud dogs - IMPORTANT!!!!

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by rolf

What is needed for a male dog to be considered a stud dog/breeding male ?
Because in the stud dog list here on WD.org there are some dogs without bonitation and HD-results, so I was wondering what is needed to be considered a stud dog/breeding male ?

Greetings Rolf

Maby this link has the info you wont ???

http://www.wolfdog.org/forum/showthr...light=studdogs

Regards / Mikael

[Mikael]

2**** from the stud dogs listing we remove all dogs that do not have HD results (Hip Displasia). This requirement is fundamental - every responsible breeder will not breed on dogs without HD results independently of requirements in their country.

At the same time all dogs with HD results that are not confirmed will disappear too. So if your dog has stud dogs status, has HD results and it does not appear on the list we ask you to contact us and send copy of OFICIAL HD results....

But I just like you Rolf, wounder about the roules,
as there is still dogs in the "Stud dogs" now 2009,
whitout HD results or Bonitation results...

So I ask to...
What is the roules for a Stud dog, now 2009 ???
( as the quote is from 2007 )

Best regards / Mikael

[admin]

Originally Posted by Mikael

But I just like you Rolf, wounder about the roules,
as there is still dogs in the "Stud dogs" now 2009,
whitout HD results or Bonitation results...

One (Aron) it there because there is small mistake in the database which will be fixed during the next update. Diego has the German ZZL and X-rays already for longer time - the result will be updated soon....

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by Admin

One (Aron) it there because there is small mistake in the database which will be fixed during the next update. Diego has the German ZZL and X-rays already for longer time - the result will be updated soon....

Thanks

But are there any other roules than HD x-ray ???

Regards / Mikael

[Juniorwolf]

So if I understand it right, only official HD-results is needed ...not bonitation ?

Greetings Rolf

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by rolf

So if I understand it right, only official HD-results is needed ...not bonitation ?

Greetings Rolf

If it is so ??? I do not only go I go

Regards / Mikael

[admin]

Originally Posted by Mikael

But are there any other roules than HD x-ray ???

The dog must be a FCI registered stud dog (+ must be HD checked also in countries where x-rays are not the part of breeding requirements).

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by Admin

The dog must be a FCI registered stud dog (+ must be HD checked also in countries where x-rays are not the part of breeding requirements).

But way not require Bonitatio at least on the stud dogs ???

To me it looks crazy to let a stud dog produce allot of offspring to are breed,
whiteout knowing that the stud are standard like in more then the look…

And way not put a maximum offspring to ??? Since some breeder do take over 100 offspring’s !!! And clearly do not care that they are creating future problems in are very narrow gene pool.

50 offspring’s is allot to, but to me a good maximum limit even for a good stud…
If that stud is so very very good fore the breed, it will clearly pas this good genes to at least some of that 50 offspring’s and if not I se no point of continue breeding on that dog anyway, at least not fore the good of the breed.

Best regards / Mikael

[wolfin]

Mikael, about ofsprings, i think if dog be good he mas have more litter, see in reality, we have interesing dogs but not have male to mate from this dogs, ok he cann have 50 pupps but when we have only 2 ... male from this same mothers to mate- for me this is bad, and better when dog have 100 pupps and more not 2 male to breed from others mother.
when i have bitch i see this problem, maybe when you have first breed steps and you see this problem.
better check not ofspring but dogs who have breed licenze - and you see others pictures.

about bonitaton- i think first mas make all with HD - later with this not all country cann this make when have 1-10 dogs, ok in LT i cann this make - have judnge category, but if not be, not all people cann travel like maniaks (yes we be ) to SK 1300 km only to make bonitation, or young club not have this money to pay judge to travel this same way.

make all in steps - first HD, latter ohers.

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by wolfin

Mikael, about ofsprings, i think if dog be good he mas have more litter, see in reality, we have interesing dogs but not have male to mate from this dogs, ok he cann have 50 pupps but when we have only 2 ... male from this same mothers to mate- for me this is bad, and better when dog have 100 pupps and more not 2 male to breed from others mother.
when i have bitch i see this problem, maybe when you have first breed steps and you see this problem.
better check not ofspring but dogs who have breed licenze - and you see others pictures.

about bonitaton- i think first mas make all with HD - later with this not all country cann this make when have 1-10 dogs, ok in LT i cann this make - have judnge category, but if not be, not all people cann travel like maniaks (yes we be ) to SK 1300 km only to make bonitation, or young club not have this money to pay judge to travel this same way.

make all in steps - first HD, latter ohers.

If a breeder can travel to mate they can travel to Bonitate !!!

The stud dogs are in my apenion to be Bonitateted as they are to be the future of are breed, do we really wont them to be P14 stud dogs

And NO !!! I will newer think taking over 50 offspring is good on a breed this smal !!!

Regards / Mikael

[Vaiva]

Originally Posted by Mikael

If a breeder can travel to mate they can travel to Bonitate !!!

The stud dogs are in my apenion to be Bonitateted as they are to be the future of are breed, do we really wont them to be P14 stud dogs

And NO !!! I will newer think taking over 50 offspring is good on a breed this smal !!!

Regards / Mikael

Mikael, if only bonitated dogs' offsprings will get pedigrees, there will be a big threat to the breed. Yes, I also would like all the wolfdogs to be bonitated, but we have to be realistic... Maybe we need to wait for 10 more years or so...

[wolfin]

Mikael, ok make in this method-
i have bitch and me interesing this dogs: Tambury z Rosikova, Gaius Dor, Dark Trencan. I wish make linie with this males and mas have reproductor from not this same bitch.
ok thake me rep list, please say hes sohn names who i cann mate, or, ok grandsohn- please thake me name dogs who have breeding licenze.
i wait.

and i say this same like Vaiva- mas make all in steps method, ok You now be pioner and fanat in your country, but when have moore people see others situation. I living more year with CSW and have new people like me friend who have CSW and know - I cann going to SK make bonitation but others not all cann. Think realistic please.

[Mikael]

I do not mean that all CsV that get mated need to have a Bonitation,
I only think that the ones that are on the Stud Dog list here on Wolfdog.org are to be,
just like the Stud dogs in CZ and SL.

And especially the ones that take many many offspring’s,
and will effect the breed allot in the future...

Very best regards / Mikael

[wolfin]

hej, not speak about "peace in world", but antswer in me concret question and speak about concret situation.
p.s. when i be younger and I think similar, but yet know who be real situation

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by wolfin

hej, not speak about "peace in world", but antswer in me concret question and speak about concret situation.
p.s. when i be younger and I think similar, but yet know who be real situation

I do not speak of a impossible thing here I just say I think ALL Stud dogs
are to have a Bonitation code, if you think differently it is up to you.

But as I did say, if a breeder can travel long way to mate I do not se any reasen way they can not travel to Bonitate, and now I´m talking about Europe (inkluding the UK) not N & S America, I understand they will not Bonitate and have there own list of Studs...

Best regards / Mikael

[Margo]

Originally Posted by Mikael

I do not speak of a impossible thing here I just say I think ALL Stud dogs are to have a Bonitation code, if you think differently it is up to you.

I agree with admin... If we will add bonitation I think before we have to add as requirement also ED-results (because it is about health), any working results (because it is about the character) and SVP1 made with the excellent note (because it is thebest check if the dog has typical body). Can someone check how many stud dogs will be still on the list if we will make it?

Mikael - bonitation is a GREAT thing but ONLY if it made by an EXPERT. In the last time there are people (even if the are CzW club judges) which make the BASIC faults during the judgement and have not the brightest idea how to make CORECT bonitation measurements. Sorry but in many cases the bonitation code is a parody. Says NOTHING about the dog... I can show you dogs which by an EXPERT will be P14 (disqualified) but get P1!!!!
WHEN we have more judges which really knows what the bonitation is about and there will be no need to travel 1000 or 2000km to make it... no problem... But so far we have to set up the rules which everybody can fulfil in his own country.

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by Margo

I agree with admin... If we will add bonitation I think before we have to add as requirement also ED-results (because it is about health), any working results (because it is about the character) and SVP1 made with the excellent note (because it is thebest check if the dog has typical body). Can someone check how many stud dogs will be still on the list if we will make it?

Mikael - bonitation is a GREAT thing but ONLY if it made by an EXPERT. In the last time there are people (even if the are CzW club judges) which make the BASIC faults during the judgement and have not the brightest idea how to make CORECT bonitation measurements. Sorry but in many cases the bonitation code is a parody. Says NOTHING about the dog... I can show you dogs which by an EXPERT will be P14 (disqualified) but get P1!!!!
WHEN we have more judges which really knows what the bonitation is about and there will be no need to travel 1000 or 2000km to make it... no problem... But so far we have to set up the rules which everybody can fulfil in his own country.

OK, thanks fore your answer.

But I think that we must trust the Bonitation codes,
if we do not the Bonitation system vill collapse, and we will be left whit only show results

And I do not think it is so hard fore a breeder in Europe to go to a Bonitation on holiday if they wont to have a Stud dog in production...

But I also think ED is to be a good demand fore the Stud dogs...

Very best regards / Mikael