2nd bonitation in Belgium

[Pavel]

Dear Liesbeth,
my comment was only for clear the situation. A always ready to help, but its me very sorry, about belgian bonitation I hear first time here from this forum. If somebody contact me before, I could try to help. Eg. 3 weeks ago we have had a club conference and it was chance to discuss about it with all important people in CZ Club. But ... I didnt know about problem !!!
And about CZ/SK problems with Jedlicka - he is one of key person in the case "Mutara" which destroy the breed and he is the person, who breeding hybrids again and illegaly registrated in Italy as pure CsW. This is the reason, why CZ Club says him good bye and this is why we never more delegate Jedlicka as judge. Yes, if he dont put back his judge registration, he still be a international judge to the end of his life, doesnt matter, that dont have contact with breed development. But think, if such person is really seriously judge of breed, which try to slowly destroy.
I would like to see, that our breed developed in each contry only positive and more people know, that I was many time abroad to help and for help am always ready.

And its really last my comment to this thema.

Pavel

[Mirkawolf]

Originally Posted by Pavel

Dear Liesbeth,
my comment was only for clear the situation. A always ready to help, but its me very sorry, about belgian bonitation I hear first time here from this forum. If somebody contact me before, I could try to help. Eg. 3 weeks ago we have had a club conference and it was chance to discuss about it with all important people in CZ Club. But ... I didnt know about problem !!!
And about CZ/SK problems with Jedlicka - he is one of key person in the case "Mutara" which destroy the breed and he is the person, who breeding hybrids again and illegaly registrated in Italy as pure CsW. This is the reason, why CZ Club says him good bye and this is why we never more delegate Jedlicka as judge. Yes, if he dont put back his judge registration, he still be a international judge to the end of his life, doesnt matter, that dont have contact with breed development. But think, if such person is really seriously judge of breed, which try to slowly destroy.
I would like to see, that our breed developed in each contry only positive and more people know, that I was many time abroad to help and for help am always ready.

And its really last my comment to this thema.

Pavel

Aha. Let me bring some light on the crap you say here. Cause I think the situation needs a bit of explanation - and truth.

1. Mr. Jedlicka did not put back his judge registration, he is still valid and approoved international judge and actively judges. He was last year twice in Italy.

2. You are not member of the club board in CR, so I don´t really see why the Belgian club should contact you about help. I did contact several members of the Czech Club board, as well as the chairman of the club. Nobody cared to help. So don´t tell me they did not know we were to make bonitation here. They do, but they don´t bother, as long as the event does not happen in their yard.

3. However is Mr. Jedlicka connected with the "Mutara" case, is not a thing to discuss here and certainly it does not affect our bonitation or his way of judging. Neither it changes the standard of CSW, so it has nothing to do with us or our bonitation.

Thank you very much for making things clear, negative advertisement is also advertisement!

[Navarre]

Originally Posted by Mirkawolf

He was last year twice in Italy.

Sorry, but really this isn't a strong point. He is higly involved with italian club because the Mutara's puppy registration made in our country by his friend of breeding comittee.
He knows well this breed, but the "bonitace" he made in Italy isn't anymore the standard bonitace of Czech Rep. as far I saw.

Tired of making so-called "italian bonitace" and tired of these people, some months ago we ask to KCSV for an help and for a Jude to make -here in Italy- a valid an up to date bonitace.

Thanks to the help of Czech club, at least we - as member of KCSV- made here in Pavia, the 2nd largest bonitace ever (n. of dogs) in the World, as you can see in dbase.
Many people here was tired of italian club, his friends, and their main target : sell puppies and destroy the breed.

After all I think too that you can choose a more approriate judge for you bonitace.

[Liesbeth]

Even if we want to take another judge: there's no judge available...
We asked several times, but no response.
J.Jedlicka was the only one willing to help...

We also want a valid and up to date bonitation. I believe this must be possible also with a judge like J.Jedlicka... But maybe I'm wrong.

Like I said: we only try to do our best. In Dutch we have that saying: (translated litteraly) You have to row with the oars you've got...

If just someone could give us good advise or help instead of saying how bad things are... (and then I'm not talking to someone personally, let that be clear; I'm thankful for all replies...).

Liesbeth

[Navarre]

1) You must choose a date that is good for everybody, judges too.

2) We' ve got about 20-25 italian memeber of KCSV, so if there are enough member of Czech (or slovakian) club in a country, the czech club could (and should) organize a bonitace in that country with his judges.

3) of course you should pay travel & lodging for judges

4) again : I'm nothing against mr. Jedlicka, I think he was a very good judge too, but some of his friends aren't good people at all.

5) As you can see italian bonitace made by this judge (and other judges) in the "italian way" are not visible anymore on this website, simply because they are'nt "bonitace", but are somthing different (but with the same codes).
You must be sure he will apply the latest rules for bonitace.

6) Anyway, goodluck

[saschia]

Originally Posted by Navarre

5) As you can see italian bonitace made by this judge (and other judges) in the "italian way" are not visible anymore on this website, simply because they are'nt "bonitace", but are somthing different (but with the same codes).

This is different situation. Italian club didn't want the bonitation to be as it is in Czech or in Slovak. They specifically didn't want the character test. And because they ddn't do the character test in our way, we cannont accept their codes as valid ones.
On the other hand, Belgian club specifically wishes to make a bonitation the same way as in countries of origin. If their test is the same as in Slovakia or Czech rep., with an international judge that is experienced with wolfdogs, their results will be valid, thats all.

[Mirkawolf]

Navarre, while I appreciate your advice, I must also react.

Originally Posted by Navarre

1) You must choose a date that is good for everybody, judges too.

Well, we knew that. But we can´t change the fact, that the judges simply are not available or not willing to come.

Originally Posted by Navarre

1)
2) We' ve got about 20-25 italian memeber of KCSV, so if there are enough member of Czech (or slovakian) club in a country, the czech club could (and should) organize a bonitace in that country with his judges.

I don´t really understand this. In all cases, and it is last time I say this, because I don´t want to repeat myself all the time, the Czech club was asked for help, and they did not respond, neither cared.

The only club who offered help was the Slovak club, however, in the end there was no Slovak judge available to come.

Originally Posted by Navarre

1)
3) of course you should pay travel & lodging for judges

That goes without saying. It is our second bonitation, we know this.

Originally Posted by Navarre

1)
4) again : I'm nothing against mr. Jedlicka, I think he was a very good judge too, but some of his friends aren't good people at all.

Friends of Mr.Jedlicka have nothing to do with our bonitation. What matters to us is that he is good judge. We are not forcing anyone to come to the bonitation, if they disagree with the judge chosen.

Originally Posted by Navarre

1)
5) As you can see italian bonitace made by this judge (and other judges) in the "italian way" are not visible anymore on this website, simply because they are'nt "bonitace", but are somthing different (but with the same codes).

What is published or not on this site, has no official value. Let´s remember this is a private website of Pavel, Przemek and Margo, and if they decide to post results of green snowmen with bonitation code, it will be perfectly within their rights.
What matters to us are official organisations, official judges and FCI rules.

Originally Posted by Navarre

1)
You must be sure he will apply the latest rules for bonitace.

That´s the point. And who says he would not, or could not?

Originally Posted by Navarre

1)
6) Anyway, goodluck

Thank you. We will need it.

[rocco]

Originally Posted by Pavel

.... CZ Club says him good bye and this is why we never more delegate Jedlicka as judge.

Pavel

No Pavel - Jindra say good bay to CZ Club - not club to Jindra . And why you know as number one .

Jindra knows the rules of bonitation very well, don't afraid .

[Pavel]

Hi Mirka,
I ask by representants of our Club and its me very sorry, that I must say, that you dont write her true.
You never asking CZ Club about help. You only send at 17.3.2008 a email, where you asking about contact on Jedlicka and Simackova (you send it not only on Club, but to privat person as well, why dont me too ???). Because they are not more members of Club, Club dont have any actually contact. Club sended to you ph nr. to Simackova and you never more contact CZ Club. So is not true, that CZ Club dont want help you. You dont ask about any judge for bonitation and just from begin you want Jedlicka or Simackova.
We have other CsW judges as well and Club can, of course, ask our Kennel Club, about e.g. delegation of national judge for bonitation. But you never interesting about it. So that please dont paint CZ Club on black colour.