Opinion on AKC/FSS registry

Dinky · 04-02-2005, 23:26

Hi, new here =]

I was wondering if anyone would know how close the CsW is to being a recognized breed in the AKC? As of right now they are on the FSS [Foundation stock service] list, but are not eligible for anything, as far as I know.

Thanks to anyone that takes the time
to answer!

..::~Dinky~::..

natbot89 · 17-02-2005, 01:16

hey i think FSS breeds can compete in companion events like agility and obedience...not sure about comformation. i know that there are rare breed, non-AKC shows in the US sometimes though.

natbot89 · 17-02-2005, 01:39

ahh after doing a bit more research i found out that FSS breeds indeed are not considered to be "registerable". this means that they can't compete in anything akc-related. what a bummer!

Cora · 18-02-2005, 05:13

ok, I just tried for the first time to reply and it seems it did not work; in the worst case my comments will show up twice...

I am currently living in the US but I am European; I discovered your website just a few days ago and since then asked some dog people here if they know the breed - so far nobody had heard about it but most have heard about some wolfmixes (I have met one here)

in regard of AKC; it sounds to me that AKC is mainly focusing on "show" and appearance and several original working breeds did not immediately join AKC; the border collie jooined pretty recently and breeders of working lines are not necessarily happy about it, the breeder association of working Kelpies for example decided as far as I know not to join AKC because this priority on "showing"; so I am not sure if it would do a breed like the CsW any good to get under the regulations of the AKC...

Cora

Dinky · 18-02-2005, 19:01

Its not that I care about "showing", I was more interested in AKC events such as the agility, obedience, and the like.

slarman · 19-02-2005, 05:34

Dinky,
I have an American Bulldog,they are not AKC recognized and the clubs in the USA don't want them to be,my point is that they sanction their own events relevant to the breeds origin and award titles.I know in the USA there are non-AKC clubs that sponsor events and awards and if you do some research there may be such a club in your state.Also go to the Schutzhund clubs they will help you.
Simon

WolfmanUSA · 26-03-2005, 17:17

Why don't CzW breeders try for UKC recognition? In reading about both clubs it seems that the UKC focuses on working ability over confirmation and the AKC is primarily focused on confirmation. While confirmation and breed standard are important, I think the working ability should be held in high regard as well. For me it just seems the AKC ruined a lot of good working breeds and I would hate to see it happen to an awsome breed like the CzW.

slarman · 27-03-2005, 03:33

WolfmanUSA,
Yes,you're correct,the UKC and NKC are more working dog oriented,and in the UKC's case it is the second largest registry in the USA.I'd say that if any American was to set up a club,as in Australia,it would be a good idea to join a large registry organisation to protect the breed under very strict constitutions such as these registries have to ensure the breed and the owners rights don't go AWOL.
Simon

johnslawek · 31-03-2005, 01:47

Hello,

In addition to the UKC and NKC you may find the following site interesting www.arba.org , as it includes a plethora of breeds not recognized by the AKC. They may satisfy your desire.

Margo · 31-03-2005, 14:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by WolfmanUSA

Why don't CzW breeders try for UKC recognition?

There is one problem - UKC is not recognized by FCI (only AKC papers are accepted).... So it would be not possible to 'exchange' dogs.....OK, it would be possible to registed dog from Europe by UKC but it is not possible to register by FCI a dog with UKC pedigree...

elkr919 · 28-11-2005, 18:35

Greetings, i live in the US and am looking for a nearby breeder (canada, US if possible). also are there any regulations for bringing Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs to the states from abroad. Thanks!

michaelundinaeichhorn · 28-11-2005, 21:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Margo

So it would be not possible to 'exchange' dogs.....OK, it would be possible to registed dog from Europe by UKC but it is not possible to register by FCI a dog with UKC pedigree...

It would be possible to get the dog registered in the FCI over the phenotypus registration. The puppies wouldn´t get normal pedigrees for some generations but that wouldn´t matter if you have the interest of the breed in mind. It would be much better than to get showing lines.

cpw · 12-04-2006, 01:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirkawolf1

Paul,
We all know CSW is no wolf-hybrid. We all know it is normal FCI recognised breed, with official pedigree and so on. However, institutions as DEFRA or the American kennel Club just refuse to accept this.

The AKC recognises CSW as a breed. They have a listing in their Foundation Stock Service.http://www.akc.org/breeds/fss_breeds.cfm

Nebulosa · 12-04-2006, 02:35

That I understand about these FSS AKC breeds, is that they are not reconigsed but can be aproved ( official) in the "working shows".
These breeds not receive the AKC "normal" register.
My opinion, is better AKC never regonigses the CzW, the AKC are "mesters" for changing the standard and make one " show breed" only. ( you can see this problem in the breed Rottweiler and Dobermann).

Greetings

Paula

Mirkawolf · 14-04-2006, 14:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by cpw

The AKC recognises CSW as a breed. They have a listing in their Foundation Stock Service.http://www.akc.org/breeds/fss_breeds.cfm

That´s crazy. If AKC really recognises CSW as a breed, why has the poor guy in USA so many problems with his CSW? Including having troubles with the vet not willing to vaccinate his CSW, thinking that it is wolf-hybrid?

(See the thread - What should I tell the vet.) I checked the link, I see they have CSW on the list of dog breeds. So why the troubles? Is it possible, that different US states would have so different rules, that they would not follow even the American Kennel Club?

GalomyOak · 20-10-2007, 04:22

This question is especially for American owners, but I'm also curious about the opinions owners/breeders in other countries. What are the feelings about registering CSWs in the FSS registry for the AKC? Has anyone registered their CSW with this service? Our GSD is registered through AKC, but the problem with AKC is that there is very little protection for the integrity and health, which are only as good as the breeders honesty. I've actually read some hostility towards AKC (from Coton De TuLear breeders, especially!) from rare breed fanciers in the US. For this breed, though, I feel as though AKC recognition offers the best "protection" with regards to legislation - not that FSS is considered recognition, but still... Also, as I read in an earlier post, FCI only recognizes AKC, so that could be an issue if someone were to consider breeding. Which I assume, most owners in US at this point are not.

I realize there are very few CSWs in the US, but has anyone ever considered starting a breed club (possibly regional, such as East Coast/West Coast?). If a club were to be started sometime in the not too distant future, would anyone be interested in participating?

Just some food for thought...
Marcy

solowolf · 21-10-2007, 22:08

Hi Marcy, I have just read up on the FSS on internet, seems you have a lot of work to do with the Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs in USA, it will take a long time to gain AKC recognition but you have to start somewhere, so go for it, for those of you on wolfdog.org interested in this discussion please look at http://www.akc.org/reg/fss_details.cfm this will help explain the breeds situation in USA, I know it will be hard and will get frustrating for you but here in u.k we have been fighting for 6 years just to get the breed of the Dangerous wild animal listing, so you are one step ahead of us already as this problem will not apply to you, any dogs you import to the USA will have there pedigrees and all can be checked and verified on this web site, you must concentrate on getting a gene pool so you can start breeding programe quickly, you can add to this as you increase in numbers, this is a wonderful breed of dog and it would be nice to see the people of USA enjoying it as well, good luck keep us posted on your progress we can be reached by email [email protected] best regards paul and mandy u.k

Hanka · 21-10-2007, 22:25

Hello Marcy,
my puppy Polo od Uhoste lives in USA- Seatle. His owner Tyson wrote to forum some articles about it. I think, it was last year. Try find it in history of forum. Hanka

wolfangel · 23-10-2007, 20:13

All US owners should register their CSV in the AKC-FSS book.
This is the very first step to obtain full recognition.
It needs 300 registered dogs.... + other things like I mentioned in forum's other answers

I'll keep the forum updated for the Canadian part... and as soon as CFC will officially register CSV, all US owners will be able to show their dogs in CFC dog shows! Only three yearly actually but more CSV we'll be there, more it will help the breed recognition. CFC have plenty of US exibitors coming with other rare breeds.

GalomyOak · 17-04-2008, 17:04

The AKC has officially changed the FSS registry name to "Czechoslovakian Vlcak" from Czechoslovakian Wolfdog, as reflected on the website.

http://www.akc.org/breeds/czechoslovakian_wolfdog/

I am hopeful that this name change will help to distance the breed from "other" unregulated types of wolfdogs in the US. Just out of curiosity, who are the dogs/people in the photos on the AKC site?

Marcy

04-02-2005, 23:26	#1
Dinky Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 2	CsW recognized by the AKC? Hi, new here =] I was wondering if anyone would know how close the CsW is to being a recognized breed in the AKC? As of right now they are on the FSS [Foundation stock service] list, but are not eligible for anything, as far as I know. Thanks to anyone that takes the time to answer! ..::~Dinky~::..

18-02-2005, 05:13	#4
Cora Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 25	US-AKC ok, I just tried for the first time to reply and it seems it did not work; in the worst case my comments will show up twice... I am currently living in the US but I am European; I discovered your website just a few days ago and since then asked some dog people here if they know the breed - so far nobody had heard about it but most have heard about some wolfmixes (I have met one here) in regard of AKC; it sounds to me that AKC is mainly focusing on "show" and appearance and several original working breeds did not immediately join AKC; the border collie jooined pretty recently and breeders of working lines are not necessarily happy about it, the breeder association of working Kelpies for example decided as far as I know not to join AKC because this priority on "showing"; so I am not sure if it would do a breed like the CsW any good to get under the regulations of the AKC... Cora

20-10-2007, 04:22	#16
GalomyOak Howling Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 436	Opinion on AKC/FSS registry This question is especially for American owners, but I'm also curious about the opinions owners/breeders in other countries. What are the feelings about registering CSWs in the FSS registry for the AKC? Has anyone registered their CSW with this service? Our GSD is registered through AKC, but the problem with AKC is that there is very little protection for the integrity and health, which are only as good as the breeders honesty. I've actually read some hostility towards AKC (from Coton De TuLear breeders, especially!) from rare breed fanciers in the US. For this breed, though, I feel as though AKC recognition offers the best "protection" with regards to legislation - not that FSS is considered recognition, but still... Also, as I read in an earlier post, FCI only recognizes AKC, so that could be an issue if someone were to consider breeding. Which I assume, most owners in US at this point are not. I realize there are very few CSWs in the US, but has anyone ever considered starting a breed club (possibly regional, such as East Coast/West Coast?). If a club were to be started sometime in the not too distant future, would anyone be interested in participating? Just some food for thought... Marcy

21-10-2007, 22:08	#17
solowolf Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 316	Fss Hi Marcy, I have just read up on the FSS on internet, seems you have a lot of work to do with the Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs in USA, it will take a long time to gain AKC recognition but you have to start somewhere, so go for it, for those of you on wolfdog.org interested in this discussion please look at http://www.akc.org/reg/fss_details.cfm this will help explain the breeds situation in USA, I know it will be hard and will get frustrating for you but here in u.k we have been fighting for 6 years just to get the breed of the Dangerous wild animal listing, so you are one step ahead of us already as this problem will not apply to you, any dogs you import to the USA will have there pedigrees and all can be checked and verified on this web site, you must concentrate on getting a gene pool so you can start breeding programe quickly, you can add to this as you increase in numbers, this is a wonderful breed of dog and it would be nice to see the people of USA enjoying it as well, good luck keep us posted on your progress we can be reached by email [email protected] best regards paul and mandy u.k

23-10-2007, 20:13	#19
wolfangel Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Quebec, Canada Posts: 9	All US owners should register their CSV in the AKC-FSS book. This is the very first step to obtain full recognition. It needs 300 registered dogs.... + other things like I mentioned in forum's other answers I'll keep the forum updated for the Canadian part... and as soon as CFC will officially register CSV, all US owners will be able to show their dogs in CFC dog shows! Only three yearly actually but more CSV we'll be there, more it will help the breed recognition. CFC have plenty of US exibitors coming with other rare breeds. __________________ *Wolfangel...* Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.

17-02-2005, 01:16	#2
natbot89 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: New York Posts: 13	hey i think FSS breeds can compete in companion events like agility and obedience...not sure about comformation. i know that there are rare breed, non-AKC shows in the US sometimes though.

17-02-2005, 01:39	#3
natbot89 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: New York Posts: 13	ahh after doing a bit more research i found out that FSS breeds indeed are not considered to be "registerable". this means that they can't compete in anything akc-related. what a bummer!

18-02-2005, 19:01	#5
Dinky Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 2	Its not that I care about "showing", I was more interested in AKC events such as the agility, obedience, and the like.

19-02-2005, 05:34	#6
slarman Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 47	Dinky, I have an American Bulldog,they are not AKC recognized and the clubs in the USA don't want them to be,my point is that they sanction their own events relevant to the breeds origin and award titles.I know in the USA there are non-AKC clubs that sponsor events and awards and if you do some research there may be such a club in your state.Also go to the Schutzhund clubs they will help you. Simon

26-03-2005, 17:17	#7
WolfmanUSA Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 9	Why don't CzW breeders try for UKC recognition? In reading about both clubs it seems that the UKC focuses on working ability over confirmation and the AKC is primarily focused on confirmation. While confirmation and breed standard are important, I think the working ability should be held in high regard as well. For me it just seems the AKC ruined a lot of good working breeds and I would hate to see it happen to an awsome breed like the CzW.

27-03-2005, 03:33	#8
slarman Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 47	WolfmanUSA, Yes,you're correct,the UKC and NKC are more working dog oriented,and in the UKC's case it is the second largest registry in the USA.I'd say that if any American was to set up a club,as in Australia,it would be a good idea to join a large registry organisation to protect the breed under very strict constitutions such as these registries have to ensure the breed and the owners rights don't go AWOL. Simon

31-03-2005, 01:47	#9
johnslawek Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Wintergreen, Virginia Posts: 20	Hello, In addition to the UKC and NKC you may find the following site interesting www.arba.org , as it includes a plethora of breeds not recognized by the AKC. They may satisfy your desire.

28-11-2005, 18:35	#11
elkr919 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 10	Greetings, i live in the US and am looking for a nearby breeder (canada, US if possible). also are there any regulations for bringing Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs to the states from abroad. Thanks!

12-04-2006, 02:35	#14
Nebulosa Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Rio Grande do Sul Posts: 1,334	That I understand about these FSS AKC breeds, is that they are not reconigsed but can be aproved ( official) in the "working shows". These breeds not receive the AKC "normal" register. My opinion, is better AKC never regonigses the CzW, the AKC are "mesters" for changing the standard and make one " show breed" only. ( you can see this problem in the breed Rottweiler and Dobermann). Greetings Paula

21-10-2007, 22:25	#18
Hanka Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Kadaň Posts: 1,622	Hello Marcy, my puppy Polo od Uhoste lives in USA- Seatle. His owner Tyson wrote to forum some articles about it. I think, it was last year. Try find it in history of forum. Hanka

17-04-2008, 17:04	#20
GalomyOak Howling Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 436	The AKC has officially changed the FSS registry name to "Czechoslovakian Vlcak" from Czechoslovakian Wolfdog, as reflected on the website. http://www.akc.org/breeds/czechoslovakian_wolfdog/ I am hopeful that this name change will help to distance the breed from "other" unregulated types of wolfdogs in the US. Just out of curiosity, who are the dogs/people in the photos on the AKC site? Marcy