CzW registration in the UK Kennel Club

solowolf · 29-04-2004, 18:24

The czechoslovakian wolfdogs registered in uk by the uk kennel club have been removed from the register in a discracful act by the kennel club. On the word of defra the czechs are condemed in uk as dangerous wild animals. I will add more later very upset regards p winder

Pavel · 30-04-2004, 07:16

HiPaul,
its absolutely terrible and incredible story !!! But my opinion ist, that you can get with the whole problem to the court. Because according the DEFRA rules (The Dangerous Wild Animals Act 1976) is absolutely clear, that our dogs are expect from this regulation. On the " Schedule of Species" is clearly written, that the species of Canis familiaris are except. Our dogs are specie of Canis familiaris. And if someone try to infirm this fact, then only shows self like a ignorant and dilettante.
Try to consult it with a law and let us know, how the whole story continued.

We cross the all fingers for you

Pavel with whole pack

Mosi · 13-05-2004, 21:16

I made a petition for personal, but i totally dont mind if you use it
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/279438817

I also made a handy image!

Pavel · 14-05-2004, 08:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mosi

I made a petition for personal, but i totally dont mind if you use it
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/279438817

Great idea, Mosi.Specialy for us, who dont know so good english.

Pavel

Mosi · 14-05-2004, 15:25

Quote:

Mosi wrote:
I made a petition for personal, but i totally dont mind if you use it
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/279438817

Great idea, Mosi.Specialy for us, who dont know so good english.

Pavel

Thank you and Im happy to be of help, 21 signitures so far. Would anyone really be against me making a pro czech website to make a summary of all our ideas? Friends of the Czech Wolfdog or something similar, im quiet good at html. I also write in pretty standard english so hopefully i wont be too hard to understand :P

gaulirmorn · 14-05-2004, 18:17

Go for it Mosi,

The more information and awareness we can generate about this atrocity the better!

I've spent this afternoon putting postings on forums, so I hope we can generate some interest that way too!

UP THE WOLFHUND!

solowolf · 16-05-2004, 15:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mosi

Im getting all my online / offline friends onto this, including an intire college basically.. Ill hand leaflets out of the street if I have to. The kennel club better listen to the young people - the future dog owners. All Pauls hard work is NOT WORTH this dismissal. Are you setting up an online petition? If not Im willing too <3.
-Amie

HI SORRY I HAVE BEEN OUT OF CONTACT I AM IN FRANCE TRYING TO SET UP METTING WITH FCI IN BELGUIM. THE KENNEL CLUB WILL NOT REPLY TO MY LETTERS. SO WHEN I FINNISH IN FRANCE I WILL ASK FOR APPOINTMENT TO SEE PRESIDENT OF KENNEL CLUB IN UK. THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR SUPPORT I HAVE JUST SIGNED PETITION THANK YOU MOSI FOR YOUR WORK GET SIGNING EVERYONE I WILL POST UPDATES AS SOON AS POSSIBLE BEST REGARDS PAUL WINDER

Navarre · 17-05-2004, 16:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mosi

I made a petition for personal, but i totally dont mind if you use it
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/279438817

done. 82 signatures now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mosi

I also made a handy image!

nice, but make ears shorter, please!!!

solowolf · 18-05-2004, 12:51

Dear Sir,

We are not used to meet people at the FCI Office as, as you can well imagine, the situation would quickly become unbearable (with 80 member organisations and several millions of breeders).

We do not feel it our duty to possibly "settle" an argument between the UK Kennel Club (which is not member of the FCI) and their breeders. This is not our business and we have no right to interfere in UK Kennel Club activities.

We are sorry that we can not help you and hope that you will manage to settle the case with the KC.

Yours sincerely

Y.De Clercq
Executive Director

solowolf · 18-05-2004, 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by pacino

Dear Sir,

We are not used to meet people at the FCI Office as, as you can well imagine, the situation would quickly become unbearable (with 80 member organisations and several millions of breeders).

We do not feel it our duty to possibly "settle" an argument between the UK Kennel Club (which is not member of the FCI) and their breeders. This is not our business and we have no right to interfere in UK Kennel Club activities.

We are sorry that we can not help you and hope that you will manage to settle the case with the KC.

Yours sincerely

Y.De Clercq
Executive Director

HI ALL, Seems even the FCI dont give a dam about the czechoslovakian wolfdogs either, the kennel club have agrement with fci on what breeds can be put up for recognition in uk the czech is within this agreement yet now the fci turn there back on me; what kind of people are they ? you can send emails to [email protected] expressing your discust at there attitude towards the breed and owners regards paul winder

Huan · 18-05-2004, 20:30

Some regulations are outside of power of FCI. For example: Sweden is a an FCI member country but CzWs and Saarlos wolfdogs are not allowed on shows and in breeding. The same is with American Staffordshire Terriers in Germany - the breeding of this breed is not allowed. What does it mean? FCI have less influence on the regulations in specific countries. You have to act within your country because FCI will not help. By the way: it's true what was written in the letter - KC is a seperate entity and FCI does not have any influence on it. Sure there are agreements between FCI and KC but I assume it does not give FCI any rights to interfare KC decisions. The only thing they can do is to make some suggestions. More nothing... It's KC and your government who took this decision and we should direct our petitions to them.

gaulirmorn · 18-05-2004, 21:49

Thanks for the info Przemek,

It's sad, but Przemek is right. I have been looking at the FCI info today, and it does seem that they only keep a register of international judges and the standards of the member breeds. They have little or nothing to do with their members rulings and appear to have no standing with the KC, who are not affiliated to the FCI.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking the FCI. It's just frustrating that they cannot help.

The question is, where do we go from here, Paul?

The trouble with the UK is that we take everything lying down. We let the government walk all over us, and on the occassions when we have stood up to them we haven't truthfully made any leeway. They just make it SEEM like we have!

The Kennel Club is a huge agency to fight, but DEFRA is even harder - being a governmental force. We need an angle on which to fight the system of hypocracry that surrounds the Czechoslovakian wolfdog in this country. Is there another canine agency in Europe that will help us in our fight?

The petition is going well, when I checked earlier we had over 100 signatures on it. But to get anywhere in the UK with this breed, it seems probable that we will have to prove that this breed is a dog, not a wolf / cross AKA United States style. It seems to me that the UK authorities have had a kind of knee jerk reaction to the Czech and Saarloos breeds because they have a higher wolf content than standard dog breeds. But they are still canines!

The big problem here is convincing the UK agencies that these dogs are plainly and simply that,... not some monster breed that will terrorise the UK.

solowolf · 19-05-2004, 08:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Przemek

Some regulations are outside of power of FCI. For example: Sweden is a an FCI member country but CzWs and Saarlos wolfdogs are not allowed on shows and in breeding. The same is with American Staffordshire Terriers in Germany - the breeding of this breed is not allowed. What does it mean? FCI have less influence on the regulations in specific countries. You have to act within your country because FCI will not help. By the way: it's true what was written in the letter - KC is a seperate entity and FCI does not have any influence on it. Sure there are agreements between FCI and KC but I assume it does not give FCI any rights to interfare KC decisions. The only thing they can do is to make some suggestions. More nothing... It's KC and your government who took this decision and we should direct our petitions to them.

YES i agree with what you say, but i was sent offical letter from kennel club it states clearly that they will only consider dogs from other countries that are reconised breed in country of origin or those which have full membership associate membership or contract membership of the F.C.I. WHICH THE CZECHS ARE. so the uk kennel club do have agreement with the FCI and it covers both the czech and saarloos, this agreement has been very badly abussed by the kennel club, all i asked the FCI for was to read and look at my case, I know the kennel club is not under FCI but when an agreement is set up then as a person i am intitled to my rights if either party breaks this agreement to ask why;;;;;; the kennel club can not give misleading or false information on offical documents to dog breeders or owners, when have you every seen or heard of such an action in the dog world, one of my last letters from kennel club stated we feel it is now nessesary for you to apply for recognition of the czechoslovakian wolfdog, 5 weeks later they removed my bitch and all pups from register, my bitch was under FCI with FCI REGISTERD EXPORT PEDIGREE, then excepted by uk kennel club and has uk registration with kc number, And now the FCI say it is not our buisness i think it is very much there buisness, one more warning to all you show people yet another agreement by kennel club and FCI at international shows winning dogs of cacib recieve invations to attend at crufts in uk, warning the czech and saarloos need dangerous wild animal lience to be in uk, the Japanese Tosa, the dogo argentinos and the fila brazillieros are all banned breeds in uk, i have seen all these breeds except the last mentioned recieve these invites at shows in europe, I now have no options left so i am taking legal action against the kennel club and FCI for giving false and misleading information to dog breeders and owners residing in europe, any owners of the above mentioned dogs with invites to crufts have right to explanation from both kennel club and the FCI as to why they are allowed to be issued to there dogs this again is false and misleading information, regards p winder

utelover · 15-01-2005, 19:25

Hi there, I'm just wondering how you are getting on in getting the KC to admit their cock up. Have they now agreed to leave these beautiful dogs on the KC register or are they still digging their heels in. I'm only asking because I am interested in this breed and would love to buy one, but if it's still in the air then I'll wait. What is the likelihood of them admitting their error and allowing the dogs to remain??

Thanks

belgshep · 15-01-2005, 19:33

The KC are not the problem,its DEFRA that is being stubborn and they are now ignoring my letters so its off to the local MP with a complaint.
Paul

29-04-2004, 18:24	#1
solowolf Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 316	CzW registration in the UK Kennel Club The czechoslovakian wolfdogs registered in uk by the uk kennel club have been removed from the register in a discracful act by the kennel club. On the word of defra the czechs are condemed in uk as dangerous wild animals. I will add more later very upset regards p winder

30-04-2004, 07:16	#2
Pavel Moderator Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 2,190	Re: CZECHS REMOVED FROM UK REGISTER HiPaul, its absolutely terrible and incredible story !!! But my opinion ist, that you can get with the whole problem to the court. Because according the DEFRA rules (The Dangerous Wild Animals Act 1976) is absolutely clear, that our dogs are expect from this regulation. On the " Schedule of Species" is clearly written, that the species of Canis familiaris are except. Our dogs are specie of Canis familiaris. And if someone try to infirm this fact, then only shows self like a ignorant and dilettante. Try to consult it with a law and let us know, how the whole story continued. We cross the all fingers for you Pavel with whole pack

13-05-2004, 21:16	#3
Mosi Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Wales Posts: 26	I made a petition for personal, but i totally dont mind if you use it http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/279438817 I also made a handy image! __________________ come see my art ---> www.afiach.deviantart.com

18-05-2004, 12:51	#9
solowolf Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 316	FCI ANSWER ABOUT CZECHS IN UK Dear Sir, We are not used to meet people at the FCI Office as, as you can well imagine, the situation would quickly become unbearable (with 80 member organisations and several millions of breeders). We do not feel it our duty to possibly "settle" an argument between the UK Kennel Club (which is not member of the FCI) and their breeders. This is not our business and we have no right to interfere in UK Kennel Club activities. We are sorry that we can not help you and hope that you will manage to settle the case with the KC. Yours sincerely Y.De Clercq Executive Director

15-01-2005, 19:25	#14
utelover Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 4	KC cock up Hi there, I'm just wondering how you are getting on in getting the KC to admit their cock up. Have they now agreed to leave these beautiful dogs on the KC register or are they still digging their heels in. I'm only asking because I am interested in this breed and would love to buy one, but if it's still in the air then I'll wait. What is the likelihood of them admitting their error and allowing the dogs to remain?? Thanks

14-05-2004, 18:17	#6
gaulirmorn Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 17	Go for it Mosi, The more information and awareness we can generate about this atrocity the better! I've spent this afternoon putting postings on forums, so I hope we can generate some interest that way too! UP THE WOLFHUND!

18-05-2004, 20:30	#11
Huan Member Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 912	Some regulations are outside of power of FCI. For example: Sweden is a an FCI member country but CzWs and Saarlos wolfdogs are not allowed on shows and in breeding. The same is with American Staffordshire Terriers in Germany - the breeding of this breed is not allowed. What does it mean? FCI have less influence on the regulations in specific countries. You have to act within your country because FCI will not help. By the way: it's true what was written in the letter - KC is a seperate entity and FCI does not have any influence on it. Sure there are agreements between FCI and KC but I assume it does not give FCI any rights to interfare KC decisions. The only thing they can do is to make some suggestions. More nothing... It's KC and your government who took this decision and we should direct our petitions to them.

18-05-2004, 21:49	#12
gaulirmorn Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 17	Thanks for the info Przemek, It's sad, but Przemek is right. I have been looking at the FCI info today, and it does seem that they only keep a register of international judges and the standards of the member breeds. They have little or nothing to do with their members rulings and appear to have no standing with the KC, who are not affiliated to the FCI. Don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking the FCI. It's just frustrating that they cannot help. The question is, where do we go from here, Paul? The trouble with the UK is that we take everything lying down. We let the government walk all over us, and on the occassions when we have stood up to them we haven't truthfully made any leeway. They just make it SEEM like we have! The Kennel Club is a huge agency to fight, but DEFRA is even harder - being a governmental force. We need an angle on which to fight the system of hypocracry that surrounds the Czechoslovakian wolfdog in this country. Is there another canine agency in Europe that will help us in our fight? The petition is going well, when I checked earlier we had over 100 signatures on it. But to get anywhere in the UK with this breed, it seems probable that we will have to prove that this breed is a dog, not a wolf / cross AKA United States style. It seems to me that the UK authorities have had a kind of knee jerk reaction to the Czech and Saarloos breeds because they have a higher wolf content than standard dog breeds. But they are still canines! The big problem here is convincing the UK agencies that these dogs are plainly and simply that,... not some monster breed that will terrorise the UK.

15-01-2005, 19:33	#15
belgshep Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 26	The KC are not the problem,its DEFRA that is being stubborn and they are now ignoring my letters so its off to the local MP with a complaint. Paul