Keep clear of Norway

[Per Olav]

Originally Posted by saschia

So this actually means that the best thing to do would be to get false papers that you wolfdog is in fact saarloos wolfdogs as they are not banned... Nice.

Well The very best is to avoid crossing the Norwegian border accompanied by a csv. On the other hand the breed is almost unknown to the public and the police. As a general rule no one are aware of the ban of our breed while the banning of the Amstaff is known to everyone due to media publisity.

The Norwegian Kennel Club and the Norwegian Society of Animal Behaviour Experts and some dedicated dog owners are working for changing the law. As a result of this I've registered increased number of visits to my homepage. Rona, Mirek, Mikje and Stefanos articles have been positively commented on different web foras and the hits on the gallery have increased as well.
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Per Olav

[Per Olav]

Originally Posted by rolf

Personally I would not take the risk that someone might think the dog is CSW and not SWH ...as the goverment of Norway will kill your dog even on suspicion even that their might not will be many CSW/SWH experts in Norway, I love my dogs too much to take that risk !

Best thing to do will be sending Per Olav good photos and videos of CSW working, interacting with children and so on, to help Per Olav promote our breed as a dog of good character and vertisile use

Greetings Rolf

I was a foreign vistor to Norway I would not risk the life of my accompanied dog. If the dog was seized and captured in a shelter the owner has to pay for its keeping, which may raise to several thousand euros before the case was brought to court. And the courts descission is predictable when it comes to banned breeds or suspected mixes.

The best way to have the law changed is by educating our government and the Norwegian public. I look forward to receive Rolf's pictures and videos. Maybe other like to share some as well?
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Per Olav

[saschia]

Per Olav, of course you can use also my pictures. They are all on wolfdog. Maybe the agility ones are interesting (dog Baby Tribec).

[Per Olav]

Originally Posted by saschia

Per Olav, of course you can use also my pictures. They are all on wolfdog. Maybe the agility ones are interesting (dog Baby Tribec).

Sure I like to. Thanks. Maybe it be possible to reach you by the personal message board? I'd prefer to present the pics by 800x600px. Most of the wolfdog.org pics are lesser sized compared to that, and on my new gallery i have the oportunity of adding more info - please have a look at my presentetation of Mikaels pictures
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Per Olav

[*Satu]

I have tracking photos (forest and feeld) if you need.

[Per Olav]

Originally Posted by *Satu

I have tracking photos (forest and feeld) if you need.

Perfect I'll send you a PM when I'm "organized"
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PO

[Per Olav]

According to media the Norwegian Police Authoryties has decided to put the American Staffordshire Terrier Majlo to death by 8th of May this year. His "crime" was crossing the Norwegian border with his owners who did not know of the Norwegian ban of the breed. In addition the owners must pay a considerable amount of money for keeping it sheltered.
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Per Olav

[Rona]

Originally Posted by Per Olav

According to media the Norwegian Police Authoryties has decided to put the American Staffordshire Terrier Majlo to death by 8th of May this year. His "crime" was crossing the Norwegian border with his owners who did not know of the Norwegian ban of the breed. In addition the owners must pay a considerable amount of money for keeping it sheltered.
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Per Olav

I don't belive!!!!

[btd]

Per: educate goverment? This sounds like grim joke. Goverment teach you, not other way.

One solution: f... norway and write about their fascist aproach.

[Per Olav]

As for our breed - the csv - I'm trying to educate the best way I can Banned breeds are more or less common in a lot of other countries, my country is no exception from the rule, but I've never heard of any innocent dog beeing put to death as this dog. With some flexibilty from our authoryties the dog easily could be returned to a new home outside my country. it's a shame.
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Per Olav

[Angelika]

Norway has a very detailed website which answers a lot of questions - also about banned breeds. If someone wants to change the country he has to inform himself before.

Nevertheless: we´ll never understand the bureaucrats - in no country.

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by Per Olav

According to media the Norwegian Police Authoryties has decided to put the American Staffordshire Terrier Majlo to death by 8th of May this year. His "crime" was crossing the Norwegian border with his owners who did not know of the Norwegian ban of the breed. In addition the owners must pay a considerable amount of money for keeping it sheltered.
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Per Olav

Hello again Per

What do the media and the people of Norway think about this decision ???
Sounds like political suicide for this government to me, if all people is against it

I did not think Norway still had death penalty, aseptically not for innocent animals…

It is not just cruel, but weak to, is this the message the government and police wont to
send out to the rest of the world

Will the government and police sleep better at night now, when decided to kill the beast ???

If I lived in Norway I would have trouble sleeping knowing that the government and police do kill pets for fun...

Sad regards to Majlo and family

[Per Olav]

Originally Posted by Mikael

If I lived in Norway I would have trouble sleeping knowing that the government and police do kill pets for fun...

Sad regards to Majlo and family

If we put put personal emotions and feelings aside, - they don't. According to law the breed is banned and Majlo illegally imported. Beeing a bit cynical: certain types of drugs are also illegally imported and will not be returned to the country of origin when discovered by national customs or police.

Of course the Majlo case is a sad one since an innocent animal is put to death due to the ignorance of its owners. But in this case the owners are to blame and no one else.

In a wider perspective the law allowing innocent animals to be put to death due to breed spesific legislation has to be changed and that is one of our aims when fighting against the law. The Majlo-case has been mentioned in our media as an example of cruel animal welfare and people are still hoping for a change by allowing the dog exported to its country of origing.

But if this had happened to a csv no one would care - the breed is commonly unknow to the public and not unlike Sweden the hate to wolves are strong among certain groups of our community.
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Per Olav

[Natalya]

Per, can I ask you a question, how do Norwegian police know the breed of foreign dog? Do they check veterinary passport or they have right to suspect some prohibited breed without making official expertise?
In case of pitbulls and staffordshire terriers, it's hard not to recognize this breed, but CsW could "accidentally" have veterinary passport with "laika" (Siberian hunting dog) or "mix" in place of breed, and it will not be so suspicious.

[Navarre]

From http://www.mattilsynet.no/
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Dangerous dogs
Published: 12.09.2005 Last updated: 14.03.2006
[i]Dangerous dogs means dogs/breeds which are particular aggressive, willing to fight and persevering, and because of these characteristics are dangerous to humans and animals. It is prohibited to keep, breed or import dangerous dogs. It is also prohibited to import semen and embryos from dangerous dogs.

Dogs of the following breeds/crossbreeds with the following breeds are considered to be dangerous:

• Pit Bull Terrier
• American Staffordshire Terrier
• Fila Brasileiro
• Toso Inu
• Dogo Argentino

Also dogs that are crossbreeds of dog and wolf are considered to be dangerous.

----------------------------------------

There isn't any info that the dog could put to death even if he is innocent of any crime!

And no mention of CSV or Sarloos, they are recognised breed and now are DOGS like german shepard...if I walk in Stockolm, who decide that my dog is a wolf, a wolf mix or a dog? And they could take my dog and kill him ?
Why can't put back the dog where he came from?

In Italy every week arrive many and many poor boat-people from Libia, they are "illegal self-imported" in our country...what should we do ? Kill them all ?



p.s.
I'm not blaming the owner of pitbull, but I blame who made so stupid law and who votes them at the election day.

[Navarre]

...of course I can walk in Oslo with my Caucasian Ovcharka...a very friendly dog

[Per Olav]

Originally Posted by Natalya

Per, can I ask you a question, how do Norwegian police know the breed of foreign dog? Do they check veterinary passport or they have right to suspect some prohibited breed without making official expertise?
In case of pitbulls and staffordshire terriers, it's hard not to recognize this breed, but CsW could "accidentally" have veterinary passport with "laika" (Siberian hunting dog) or "mix" in place of breed, and it will not be so suspicious.

Hi.

As for which breeds are banned Navarre qouted the complete list of Norwegian banned breeds. Except for Amstaff and CSV they all were banned by 1991 and no individuals from before 1991 will be present here today.

Amstaffs and CSV's imported before the ban are fully legal but the owners have to prove their origin by offical documents like pedigree papers etc.
Of course the owner may fake the papers of the dog, but on suspicion the police may shelter it for further investigation and if in doubt the animal may (not necessarily ) be euthanized. If such attempt of faking the dog's papers is discovered the dog most likely will be put to death,

As Navarre writes the dog might not be killed, but for now no trials has ended without a death penalty.
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PO

PS. Both the prosecutor and the prosecuted may use experts if they like. Last year a dog was seized on suspicon of beeing a Pitbull mix. The procecuded owner called a Swedish expert who concluded that the dog most likely NOT was a Pitbull mix. The prosecutor overruled the expert and the dog was put to death. The term MOST LIKELY made the difference of life or death and how can one prove the origin of a mix?

[Navarre]

I think that tourists should be made AWARE that their pets could be killed during their holydays in Norway.

[Natalya]

Per, I'm not a lawer, but we live in XXI century, and final word must come from genetic tests, if we talk about official suspicion and trial procedure.
My question was mostly about situation of short stay or transit. In some countries, police strongly believe in written paper with a stamp in such situations.

[Per Olav]

Originally Posted by Natalya

Per, I'm not a lawer, but we live in XXI century, and final word must come from genetic tests, if we talk about official suspicion and trial procedure.
My question was mostly about situation of short stay or transit. In some countries, police strongly believe in written paper with a stamp in such situations.

Like you I'm no lawyer and know little of genetics but I believe is it not possible above doubts to prove the ancestral heritage of a mix or even a pure bred dog?

As of transit: here is a official document from our Ministry of Justice and Police.

Based on rumours of illegally imported Amstaffs by the use of fake documents the police in one of our counties made a razzia and captured and sheltered some dogs. Their future are told to be quite uncertain.
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PO