Artificial insemination only solution for the breed in spain? - Page 3

carlos2207 · 08-09-2009, 17:09

I like very much this post, I see very intelligent and razonable argument for not use the AI.

Juniorwolf · 08-09-2009, 17:19

I think it is quit interesting, that non of you who have been speaking for AI, have commented the other solutions, now when you have so big problems by traveling to the stud dog...

Have you even tried to ask owners of stud dogs to fly the dog to you, so you don`t have to travel ?
Have you concidered to buy a stud dog(or more), which can be used more than once and with different females ?

Greetings Rolf

09-09-2009, 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by rolf

... in any case [AI] should be last choice, as I think all other options is to prefer, but that is just my humble opinion !

Greetings Rolf

I think this is stated simply, and perfectly.

Even living in the US, if I had a bitch I was hoping to breed, obviously my preferred choice would be to actually use a stud dog and not AI. Natural breeding is very important and lack of its use can do more harm than good. Not that I would expect CsVs to ever get to this point, but with English Bulldogs, for example, AI (and also C-section birth) is the norm because the breed has changed so much that 90% of the time, this is the ONLY way the dogs can be bred. We would never want something like that to happen with the CsV!!

However, I think a note should be made that quality is definitely a factor in this. The biggest effort should be in finding an appropriate stud dog that would blend well with the bitch. I don't think quality in this regard should be sacrificed if the owner of the stud couldn't send him over for a "vacation"

if there were a less desirable stud who could. I think that the quality of the dogs being produced should be a major, major factor in the decision to breed, and if the case came up where no suitable stud could be used naturally, that's when AI should be considered.

We all have to understand that as in everything that matters, there are going to be grey areas, and decisions really need to be made on a case by case basis, and not broad, sweeping generalizations one way or the other.

09-09-2009, 17:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by rolf

Have you concidered to buy a stud dog(or more), which can be used more than once and with different females ?

I like this option, but it's a slippery slope and one that should be considered heavily before putting into action. While I'm sure you'd get a lot of useful litters out of the stud, you have to remember about genetic diversity. Going this route, you may run into the same problem of having a lot of repeat breeding. However, it's definitely a great idea, especially if the stud is an adult already and fully developed, so you know how well he would work with the females you'd want to breed.

Something also to consider is that "popular" stud dogs have been a problem with bottle-necking genetics in dogs in the past. The German Shepherd, for example, the dog used in producing CsVs in the first place, has this exact problem because in the past, popular, high-winning studs were used so often that they really shrank the genetic diversity in the dogs' pedigrees. GSDs are plagued with a host of genetic problems, and it's quite possible that the use of stud dogs in this way has played a factor. I can't remember the exact numbers, but I remember reading before that the ratio of studs to bitches in wolves in the wild is close to 50-50, but with purebred dogs, the numbers are greatly skewed, with far less studs being used than bitches.

Just something to think about!

Tuky · 10-09-2009, 11:48

To bring to males studs is a good idea, but since Vicky has said, you do not also solve the genetic changeability that is about what we "complain" in Spain, since the same would happen but with this new male.

To rent a male ... good, this year all the litters (if it comes to them well to the breeding grounds) would be almost equal ... in a country with many breeding grounds good can come, they not all will do the amount with.
I prefieron a Natural amount, but it is necessary to say that the IA is an advance for the increase of the genetic changeability and development of the race, (being scarce in the CsV). The post was alone to open the minds for the veterinary advances to help

As last, in my opinion ... it is difficult that they leave you a rented male, for the simple one I throw that it is an alive being ... to that his proprietor has fondness, I have not bred CsV but when I send my female of husky (when his days keys prevent me from going for study or university) to house of the male stud remains a gap and a worry until she returns... Do not tell that there is many male's proprietors that he does not like that strange dogs remain in his houses, especially of particular proprietors

carlos2207 · 10-09-2009, 14:42

A little of common sense!!! Thanks Tuky!!!

10-09-2009, 11:48	#45
Tuky Moderator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Cadiz Posts: 294	To bring to males studs is a good idea, but since Vicky has said, you do not also solve the genetic changeability that is about what we "complain" in Spain, since the same would happen but with this new male. To rent a male ... good, this year all the litters (if it comes to them well to the breeding grounds) would be almost equal ... in a country with many breeding grounds good can come, they not all will do the amount with. I prefieron a Natural amount, but it is necessary to say that the IA is an advance for the increase of the genetic changeability and development of the race, (being scarce in the CsV). The post was alone to open the minds for the veterinary advances to help As last, in my opinion ... it is difficult that they leave you a rented male, for the simple one I throw that it is an alive being ... to that his proprietor has fondness, I have not bred CsV but when I send my female of husky (when his days keys prevent me from going for study or university) to house of the male stud remains a gap and a worry until she returns... Do not tell that there is many male's proprietors that he does not like that strange dogs remain in his houses, especially of particular proprietors __________________ solo con los lobos se aprende a aullar

08-09-2009, 17:09	#41
carlos2207 Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 48	I like very much this post, I see very intelligent and razonable argument for not use the AI.

08-09-2009, 17:19	#42
Juniorwolf Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 575	I think it is quit interesting, that non of you who have been speaking for AI, have commented the other solutions, now when you have so big problems by traveling to the stud dog... Have you even tried to ask owners of stud dogs to fly the dog to you, so you don`t have to travel ? Have you concidered to buy a stud dog(or more), which can be used more than once and with different females ? Greetings Rolf

10-09-2009, 14:42	#46
carlos2207 Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 48	A little of common sense!!! Thanks Tuky!!!