SVP - when & where?
 

When and were are those exams ? I only see 11 october in Jevisivice.
Patrick

SVP1-3 runs in Slovakia (Samorin):
05/04/2008
04/10/2008

Thank you.
Can every CSW, from every country participate to those exams?
Patrick

No, only choosen ones ;) Just kidding... There is no limitation in regards to origin of the CzW or the dog owner. There were already people from different countries that did SVP.

ok, where to or who to , I need to send my participation?
Patrick

The entry request should be sent to Livia Cervenanska: [email protected].

The run takes place in Cilistov near Samorin (20-30km from Bratislava).

Where is Cilistov: Google maps

When: 7:00am on 05/04/2007

Meeting point: on the parking place near the hotel "Kormoran" in Cilistov

Track: Map The track goes by the Dunaj river. 20km to Baka village and 20km back. Very simple track without chance of losing yourself.

OK, one explanation:

So far the ONLY official exams take place in Slovakia and Lithuania. Only in this countries you can get the official certificates.... and only in Slovakia you can get the "working CACs" (CACTs).
In other countries the run is just "for fun".

When I will get new info about countries which recognized the SVP1-3 exams I will write it here...

Are those exams already recognised by the FCI ?
If yes, the other countries must follow? Also Belgium
Patrick

That's the point... :rock_3 SVP1-3 are already FCI recognized exams BUT (always is a "but" ;-)) every country must translate the rules and "teach" the working judges what is going on by these exams... After your kennel club will recognize it you can make the OFFICIAL SVP runs... easy but someone must care for it in every country...
Anyway we would be happy if there will be such runs in different countries... :p

as far as I know SVP1-3 and ZVP1-3 is the same ...just that SVP is in Slovakia and ZVP is in Czech rep. !

Can anybody tell me why it is not possible to get CACTs when making ZVP :confused2 ...I mean if it is the same exam, the same rules should aply ???
...and if you can make SVP1-3 in Lithuania, then why is it only in Slovakia you can get CACTs ?

Greetings Rolf

CACT you can get only in exam which is organized under certain conditions, not only the rules, but for example also with certified judge...

Thanks for your reply Saschia :)
ok ...so if I understand you right, it will be possible to get CACT during ZVP if the right judges is judging this trial/exam(and it will also be possible to get CACT in Lithuania if the right judges is invited).

...or is there something else who need to be corrected before this is possible ?

Greetings Rolf

Hi Rolf, unfortunately I don't know anything more about the CACT exams. But it is similar to CAC and CACIB awards - you only can get them at events, which are according to some rules, with certified judges, and so on, but who says it is OK and where to apply to be able to organize such think - that I don't know...

Once again thanks for your reply :)

I dont know either ....but I will try to find out :)

Greetings Rolf

No... 8)

First: what is an OFFICIAL exam?
You have one if the judge has the right to judge such exams, the rules are recognized in the specific country, the date of the exams is applied according the rules for all working exams AND last but not least after you pass the exam you will get the international certificate from the kennel club about passing an exams required for the working class.
So far as I wrote ONLY the Slovak and Lithuanian exams fulfil all the conditions....

ADDITIONALY the exams in Slovakia are registered by their kennel club not only as exams but also as competitions where the CACTs can be given....

Hi Margo

Thanks for detailed explanation :)

So if I get this right ? ...all there have to be changed to be able to get CACT when passing ZVP is : education of Czech judges or invitation of Slovak judges who have the right to judge these exams, the date of exams is applied according to the rules for all working exams and then it will be possible to give the international certificat(CACT) about passing exams required for working class.
....Did I get this right ? :)

Greetings Rolf

It is even easier - ask your kennel club to translate and accept the rules (the official rules were translated so far I know to English and German) and can be obtained by the FCI office. After Danish Kennel Club will recognize the SVP1-3 exams every working judge from your country can be judge for it.... (in some countries the judges for the working exams must pass additional courses or seminars to have the right to judge new competitions but I do not know the regulations in your country).

Thanks again Margo :)

In Denmark there will never be enough people to attend SVP1-3 so there is no reason for Danish Kennel Club to make these exams just for me and Uno ;-) ...I was just wondering why it is not possible to get CACT when passing ZVP1-3 !
...and also it would be very nice(and for me, more easy) if we could make this exam + get the CACT when we visit summercamp in Czech rep. as we do every year. ....but anyway we will come to Slovakia for next SVP :)

Greetings Rolf

Don't be so pesimistic... :rock_3 If the exams will be accepted in DK you can always invite a judge (for example) from Slovakia and make at the same weekend (?) endurance run, bonitation and meeting. Not only for you - don't forget German, Dutch, and other people which for sure will some for such meeting... Also for us it would be nice to go and make the same run going by bike along the beautiful beach in Danemark... 8)

Thanks for your optimism Margo ;-)

But I do not trust that Danish Kennel Club will accept this exam only for me and Uno + invited wolfdog-owners from other countries, it will also be special club(KHKG) who must accept this exam too and in special club we are only 3-4 members with wolfdogs(and many more with other breeds) and I am the only one who is training and showing my wolfdog in our club :(
I am not even sure that I can get any other Danish wolfdog-owners to come for this meeting that I planned to make in 2010(at same time as worlddogshow will be in Denmark) ....but now you have at least inspired me to try to get Danish Kennel Club to accept this exam :)
....I will let you know the Answer from Danish Kennel Club !

Greetings Rolf

I have just been reading the rules(again) for SVP1-3 and I maybe asking stupid but I dont know what is this : "CWBC SR" and "SPZ" ?
...it says at Trial participation conditions part 6)

" The propositions for a trail are to be drawn up by the CWBC SR sufficiently in advance and presented to the SPZ for approval, which in turn sends them to the delegated judge."

I will be very thanksfull for any help I can get to convince Danish Kennel Club to approve these exams :)

Greetings Rolf

Ups !!! I am sorry :oops:...I already found out what it is ..it is written earlier in the tekst !

I have a question about SVP1-3 :

When completed for example SVP1 will the dog have same kind of working certificat as if the dog completed IPO1 ? ...or is it only the fastest dog of each exam(SVP1, SVP2 and SVP3) who will get working certificat ?

Greetings Rolf

more questions about SVP1-3 :

The course that the dog endurance trial is to be held on must satisfy the following requirements:

"1)at least 2/3 of the course must have a natural surface (grass, field or forest pathways)" ...is it possible to make the course on a asphalt road with grass at the edge of the road(so the dog can choose to run in the grass) or must the whole road be a natural surface(in at least 2/3 of the course) ?

Course shape: a) a circuit, where only overtaking of handlers with dogs occurs, must be at least 5 km in length
b) a straight course, where overtaking and meeting of handlers with dogs occurs, must be at least 10 km in length.
.....does this mean the the course can not be at a normal road with cars and other traffic ?

Greetings Rolf

Approval of SVP1-3 will hopefully happen soon in DK.
 

Now that I have become breed representative for Czechoslovakian wolfdogs in Denmark(DKK/KHKG) :rock_3 ...the board of special club(KHKG) will have this trial for approval on next board meeting and it should be no problem to get the approval by KHKG :)
....after approval by KHKG(special club) Danish Kennel Club(Dansk-Kennel-Klub/DKK) must approve it too !

So hopefully I can offer SVP1-3 trials at the 1. Danish Czechoslovakian wolfdog-meeting in 2010 ;-)

Greetings Rolf

I will keep my fingers crossed for you...

Thanks a lot ;-)

I have plans of lure coursing and bonitation too ...and ofcourse trip to worlddogshow witch will be in Denmark at same time :)

Greetings Rolf

A dog with SVP1-3 (SK) or ZVP1-3 (CZ) doesn't get certificate as IPO1 (you meant permission for working class at all types of dogshows). There are international rules - you want working class, do the IPO or something similar. In CZ we have also ZVV1 and ZPU2 similar to IPO1, with all 3 disciplines as IPO and we get the same certificate as for IPO1.
Also, in CZ you can't get title Czech Champion without an international certificate for working class. So finally, good dog should be clever and handsome too ;-)
And to tell the truth, I'm glad. Working dog should do more than just run :lol:


But I don't want you to disunderstand me, my dog have got ZVP1, ZVP2 and SVP1 as well. Now I must prepare myself for ZVP3 (100km). My dog is ready everytime, but me not :chaos
For my dog this is pleasure. For me pleasure and a hard work. 8)

I don`t understand what you mean ? ....If I have understod this right, you can get CACT(certificate for working class) when passing SVP1-3 and this give your dog right to attend working-class at dogshows.

I am not all sure about the difference between CACIT(international certificate for working class) and CACT, so please correct me if I am wrong :confused2 ....sorry but I am new in this world of training for exams and titels from dogshows :Help_2

The more I know about thise trials the easier it will be for me to convince KHKG(special club) and Danish kennel club to approve thise trials in Denmark :)

In Denmark you need to pass some easier exams to be allowed to train for IPO or BHP(similar to IPO) so this is what we do for now and I also plan to make SVP1 with Uno in October :rock_3

sorry for the big text :oops:

So, that was what I've read too, for homologue the international championship title is needed IPO1 or Sch1 or 40km endurance.

I agree that run 40km not select behaviour, but select the capacity of the body for work, that is too important as the character.
What's the point to have a dog with super character that isn't able to run few kilometers to catch a bandit and fight with full power, or maybe to walk long and dificult path's for rescue lost people?
Have a dog with bad body and no endurance at work is too bad and even more dangerous than have a dog with no caracter for "work", the dog without behaviour will simply not be used, the dog without resistence will be and can cause some serious problems because this.
Of course I agree that endurance test cannot be considerate exactly a working test because the dog only run, but it test the body capacity of the dog to work, and that is important too seing that some dogs loose their ability to work because the bad selection that only had eyes to win dogshows and impressing judges.
Oterwise, at GSD we can see some show dogs with no behavior even for protect his own territory, with titles as Sch1 or IPO1 only for get the homologation of the Internationa champion, dog's like that never will have body capacity to run as will never work, but can do a very beautifull show at working test in basic level.
In French ( and I think have other countries too) is forbidden to make protection work with CzW (and other breeds), so, if this option of the endurance test not exist these people will never be able to get international champion with their dog's.

and thanks for your opinion/explanation ....I fully agree with this ;-)

You asked about certificate, and its not the same thing as CACT or CACIT.

CACT gets the best dog in every cathegory. But certificate gets every dog who made for example IPO... Ask at you kennel club about the diference, they shoul give you better answer. You mixed this two terms together.
In CZ, CACT for SVP1 doesn't mean anything for going to dogshows to the working class. SVP1 is simply too low rated. But, if you want, you can collect several CACT and become Champion of Work. But you don't get Czech Champion for CACT from Slovakia.

About 40km run - I think its too low. If you want certificate for proving endurace of a dog, try to stand for higher rate.
My dog have done ZVP1 and ZVP2 and both without training - i just take my bicycle, my dog and that was all.
But 40km in 4 hours should't be nothing for good dog with good natural endurance. When we finished 40km, my dog wanted wather, 20minutes of rest and than played with others.
70km, well, that's another cup of tea, my dog was tired after we finished. Some of dogs have problem with finishing the ZVP2.

We have got White Switzerland Shepperd and also mixed malamut at ZVP1 and they have no problem with getting excellent mark. Do you still think that 40km is enough for getting certificate for CSW?

No offence (I hope you don't misunderstand me), but you didn't try SVP. I've done three of them with one dog. I know that for beginner looks 40km as a long way to go, but it isn't and shouldn't be for every CSW.
Certificate was meant for a dog that can do more than average dog of a breed. So if you want certificate for SVP2 or SVP3 I thing it's alright, but for SVP1 it would be degradation of endurance of CSW.
Also in SK you don't get the same type of certificate as for IPO1.

And you shold also know that for get the title champion at almost all countries, you don't need any certificate. I thing it's the point behind this all.

First of all I really don`t get easily offended ;-) but now I really don`t understand ????

CACT I can not find anything about, but CACIT is a Certificate(Certificat d`aptitude au Championnat international de Travail) .....according to FCI ? so I think CACT must be the same as CACIT just national Certificat and not international Certificat ?

My kennel club have no rules for workingclass or International Champion for CSW ....because no one have ever done it ...yet ! I am going to set the rules together with the kennel club at the next board-meeting ...approval of SVP1-3 in Dk will be after I have passed(or tried passing) SVP1 with Uno :rock_3 ...for title Danish Champion dog need only 3 x CAC in DK by 3 different judges ...that is all !

....and no I don`t think 40km is very long way to run for a CSW(I have maybe not tried SVP yet, but I often bicycle/run 15-20km and sometimes more with my dog and we have passed UHP witch is 20km for German shepherds and he could easily run from all of the German shepherds ...and run twice the distance if needed), but many German shepherds(and other working breeds too) would never be able to run 40km in 4 hours !
White German shepherds and Malamute also have better body for running(Malamute is made for running) than "normal" German shepherds so offcourse they can pass 40km in 4 hours ....IF they have body condition for this, witch is the purpose of the trial( The objective of the trial is to create the conditions for systematic monitoring of good breeding practice aimed at attaining the standard of the CW breed. One of the key traits of a CW is its endurance). :)

What is the name of Certificate for IPO/ZVV1/ZPU2 ?

Do you get CACT for best dog in ZVP1-3 too or is it only in SVP1-3 ?

If I get this right, then when sveral CACT`s is collected you can be working Champion ....that must also mean that you can show your dog in working class ??? ...or how can you be working Champion without working certificat ??? ....sorry, but to me that sounds crazy :shock:

"Passing the trial according to the Trial Rules satisfies the conditions of the working trial for awarding of the title International Beauty Champion – FCI." ....If FCI have approved SVP1 as working trial for International beauty Champion, then offcourse it must be good enough for national Champion title too !?!? ....at least this is my opinion 8)

I'm sorry I haven't much time for answer now, just this thing:

Every country has different rules for championship. In SK dog doesn't need any working trial to be Slovak Champion of Beauty. Also, in Slovakia, you can get CACT for SVP1 (first dog get it) - so dog can be Slovak Champion of work with just SPV1 - it's very comic situation, don't you thing? So I'm sorry for the mistake, I didn't wrote the country in the title.

But in CZ, you dog must have working certificate (to say in different way - must done a trial that really satisfies international conditions).

There is something wrong with SVP, because only country that allows you to get International Champion for a dog with only SVP is only Slovakia :lol: Here in CZ they would think you are kindding in the office, if you want IntCh with just a ZVP or SVP.

Problem is that some things have loose ends. I don't understand SK conditions either, because SVP DOESN'T satisfies the conditions of the INTERNATIONAL working trial, even if SK are telling you that.
SVP is only national trial with only national results. Ask at FCI, you get the same answer. Because for FCI a working doesn't mean a running.

For Int.Ch with CZW, your organization in your country must answer you if you need any trial!!!

Hey, I goe it! SVP is old. It rules were made when every coutry could named which trial is enough. It was writen BEFORE FCI took the iniciative and made international rules for working dog and SVP didn't fit in it.

If CACT is not working certificat, then what is working certificat(what is the name of this certificat for IPO) ?

Yes I think working Champion must be more than running, National and International beauty Champion is okey for me with just running.

Organization(DKK) and special club(KHKG) in my country have asked me what CSW will need to get title Int.Ch, because I am breed-representative(protector) of CSW in Denmark 8) ....they don`t know anything about training abilities for CSW and no one have ever tried to make titels Int.Ch or working Champion for CSW in Denmark before, so they really don`t know what will be fair for getting thise titles ? that is why they ask me what do I think .....and I think that CSW must need the same as in countries of origin, but it seems that countries of origin(Czech rep./Slovakia) have different opinions of what is needed for this titels ? ...this is why I ask thise questions here ! :)

BTW : In Denmark we are only 4 members of special club KHKG, and I am the only one who is training and showing CSW in Denmark at this moment.

Dayen, you are wrong. Now I understand why you overreacted on the dog show last time in Bratislava. It's official that SVP1 (not ZVP1) is sufficient to get the International Champion title and your kennel club office has nothing to say because it's FCI board in Belgium that decides about the requirements for IntChampion not the national organisations. It's the fact that FCI did approve SVP as the exam for working class and IntCh title. If your office says different it means they are missinformed. They should just send the papers to Belgium and wait for an reply and not doing any problems.

An example. Amber Wolf which did SVP1:
http://huan.pl/temp/AMBER-INTER.JPG

If you make SVP1 exam in Slovakia you can request an official international working certificate from SKJ by paying 5 EUR.

Hi Przemek,

Thanks a lot for info :)

I have just send an email to FCI about this and are waiting for answer
....I will get back with answer from FCI !

btw : will you(and dog) by any chance make more SVP-exams in October this year ? ....I have many questions I would like to ask about this trial :)

hmmm:) i wrigth in this metod

1. dogs with SVP going to working class.
2. dogs with SVP cann have CACT
3. dogs with SVP cann have INT CH.

and 4 . SVP IS SPECIAL EXAM to CZECHOSLOWAKIAN WOLFDOGS

maybe this email help:
----------------------

Subject: To the attention of Mrs Daiva Rimaityte
Sender: Grazie Soravia <[email protected]>
Recipient: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Date: 18.04.2006 09:43

Dear Mrs Rimaityte,

The breed Czechoslovakian Wolfdog is indeed submitted to a working trial, - an endurance test of 40 KMs or the IPO 1 or the Schutzhund - are trials recognized for obtaining the title of international champion for this breed.

I hope that I have answered your question.

Yours sincerely
The FCI Secretariat
G.Soravia

for me and for me land (and others land who living wolfdogs) SVP is normal working exam from THIS breed.

Hi Daiva

Thanks a lot for info :)

I just got this answer from FCI :

Dear Mister Larsen,

We inform you that we have contacted the Slovenska Kynologicka Jednota to
obtain more precisions in this regard.
We will contact you again as soon as we have received an answer.
In advance, we thank you for your understanding.

Yours sincerely,

VERBRUGGEN Géraldine
Tile Dpt
FCI

.....I will return with final answer ;-)

Hi,
I received the same mail by FCI. Do you have receive an answer Rolf ?
SCC (Kennel club for France) have send me a mail where they said that SVP1 isn't recongnize for work exam. Im' waiting for FCI :cry:

but IF dog - wolfdog with SVP CANN have INT CH - i think SVP is working exam.

(INT CH cann have dogs only with work exams, and if cann this have :rock_3 ..... )

Yes I'm agree with you, but France Kenel Club say that dog can't do INT CH with SVP1 because it'isnt a working exam. And FCI don't give an answer. France Kenel Club can't give you stud book because they don't recognize SVP1 !!! My dog Gabina has a stud book because she's birth in Czech Republik but for my french' dog, it's a problem, I can't to have stud book by France :evil:
It'is possible to buy Stud book in an another country ?

Hi Pivoine,

No I did not get an answer yet from FCI, but as soon as I get an answer I will post it here in this thread ...as I promised ;-)

thanks Rolf :cool3

Hej,
INT CH TAKE not Franc club or Lithuanian or Germany club BUT only FCI from Belgian :)

ant in this case french club not cann make :) INT CH is FCI titels :)

Eh Daiva, where you see "work" during this exam? I find and find and I can´t see it. Only running. And I think, all shy dogs can run. And some- very quickly:).
In Czech republic- SVP is not working exam and dogs with this exam can´t go to working class. It is right.

i know, only i say: INT CH you cann have with SVP.

OK, bye:):):)

well the question should be if FCI will see SVP as working-exam ?
FCI can only give title INT CH for dogs of this breed with working-exam(according to breed-standart) !
....so if dogs of this breed who have passed SVP can get INT CH, FCI have classified SVP as working-exam !

Please correct me if I am wrong ;)

thanks for informations.
Yes Rolf, I understand that ; dog can be INT CH FCI if he has SVP1 in Slovakia. But my problem is why FCI don't say me if it's ok for that and and must waiting an confirmation in oder to sure.
And how to have stud book...

I know some CSW`s have got titel INT CH from SVP(proove is earlier in this thread), but I did not get comfirmation from FCI my self yet ?
if FCI have reconized SVP for working-exam, then kennel clubs of each country must accept this ofcourse or make FCI change the rules ! ...or exclude themselves from FCI ?
in other words when FCI have given a CSW with passed SVP title INT CH in your country, your kennel club of your country must accept SVP as working-exam !
I dont know what is stud book ? ...pedigree, book of results for working or what ?

I think there is a misunderstanding here, stud book in my opinion means breed register of a country where the dog received its pedigree.

In some countries the results of shows, trials and competitions are not entered into the pedigree but to a booklet which comes with it (I don't know the name of this booklet). Also some trials require special booklet (when I did agility with my wolfdog cca 15 years ago it was like that for agility in Slovakia at least). I think pivoine means this.

Ok, I waiting for FCI answer.
I thought that the stud book was a work book, but know :lol::lol::lol:, it's the number of pedigree, sorry for this mistake :oops:

yes Sashcia and thanks, it's a mistake of me :oops:

Thanks for explanation Saschia :)

I have 1 book for Czech exams and 2 different books for Danish exams, for Danish show results we only get a diploma and titles as DK CH will be addet to pedigree.....

waooooooooo. I saw the results SVP1 the month of April! 2:03 for the winner ! Very great. I'm sorry, I'll ask a stupid question ... The dogs run or walk fast (to trot ?) ? Do they alternate running and trot ?. Thank you.

Hi Pivoine,

The dogs can run or trot as they like, but for 40km or more running is very hard, when wolfdogs trot they are very energy efficient and can trot for long distances(SVP3 = 100km) ;-)

Greetings Rolf

Hi Rolf,
Thanks for your answer.
I do bike with my dog and he do only trot, sometime he run. So I understand it's good to alternate on long distance.
Thanks :p

Hello, does anyone can help me and say how to register WD for running exam for 40 km in Slovakia this year 04/10/2008 thanks

Hi, you need to send info about your dog and your contacts (in case something changes) to [email protected]. But don't expect answer from Livia this week as she is quite busy. You can download appplication form here: http://www.csv.sk/docs/ssvp.doc The payment is on site.

You will need to bring your dog's pedigree (or a copy) and PET PASSPORT.

For more detailed info in german contact Livia, in english me ([email protected]).

Is it possible to make this request without being member of the Slovakian club ? and for who should the request be send ?

Rolf

Where to send the application and the payment for SVP1 ?

Rolf

Yes, you don't need to be a member, only prices for nonmembers are higher (but still nothing compared to travel expenses for some, I think).

Payment is not in advance, when you come, you pay. Send all the info to [email protected], that's all. All that's important in the appliction form is also in english and german, so that you know what you need to fill in.

Thanks a lot for info Saschia :)

Greetings Rolf