Misrepresentation of Wolfdogs.
 

Today I happened to come across something which I believe to be a misrepresentation of a wolfdog as a wolf, I was shopping with my wife (some of you might know her as Mirkawolf) when we came across a calendar labelled “wolves” as usual my wife stopped for a closer look, and noted that in her opinion the so called “wolves” were in fact wolfdogs.

You can check for yourself, the photographer responsible for this calendar has kindly put up a few of his shots:

http://www.fabioliverani.com/calen_02.htm
http://www.fabioliverani.com/calen_04.htm
http://www.fabioliverani.com/calendari.htm#lupocal

If you think they are not wolfdogs feel free to correct us

The misrepresentation of Wolfdogs raises some interesting issues which I do not know if they have been considered here in the past.

First there is a legal issue. This is particularly poignant in the UK where there is a question right now of discussions with DEFRA on the future of wolfdogs in the UK. DEFRA has already stated in a position paper than any animal which cannot be distinguished from a wild animal is to be considered as a wild animal. The misrepresentation of wolfdogs as wolves obviously reinforces DEFRAs case against the introduction of the wolfdogs there.

The problem goes much farther than that though. Naturally we love wolfdogs and we love the fact that they are closer to wolves than your average dog. But the representation of a wolfdog as a wolf, can be very counter productive. For one thing the public at large is generally misinformed about the nature of wolves. If people think that wolfdogs ARE wolves, they will react to them in strange ways. This goes from the mother who picks up her child and runs away from the “wolf” (This has actually happened to me while walking our dog on leash) to people misusing the breed, either by crossing it with wolfhybrids and wolves, and believing they can get away with it.

There are also a few situations when the representation of a wolfdog as a wolf might be justified and even useful. I have heard that wolfdogs have been used in some movies to play the parts of wolves, which is reasonable enough given that
1) Wild wolves do not cooperate well with cameras
2) The people using the wolfdogs are aware they are not using wolves, and anyone who actually does some research into the movie will know that those “wolves” were in fact wolfdogs

You can probably come up with more examples. Two things stand out in my mind,

On the one hand I believe that the representation of wolfdogs as wolves can lead to serious trouble. What do you think?

Secondly if you believe that the animals on the calendar are wolfdogs and not wolves, do you think something should be kindly said to the photographer responsible for this calendar? I think it would be very nice to have a wolfdog calendar on the wall but it is silly to have it be called a wolf calendar, not a wolfdog calendar.

A very good post and I agree that these are not pure wolves and as such it does nobody any favours.
As for the UK situation the main problem is that unlike the GSD which dropped the name Alsatian Wolfdog very quickly the czech needs to do the same as this does nothing other than to encourage the wrong type of people to want one and plays into the hands of the likes of DEFRA who simply say that it is part wolf because thats what you call it,the fact that they are in the main many generations removed from the wolf has no meaning to them and until a genetic test can prove the real amount of wolf in both the czech and the gsd I dont think we are going to get anywhere.
There are many cases of recent wolf blood being added to the GSD but it is not made obvious and I am certain that some of these dogs have been imported into the UK for breeding one I recently saw was more wolf than GSD but was accepted as a pure GSD because of its paperwork.
The fact that the FCI accepts them means nothing in the UK and a few other countries.
What does annoy me is that both czechs and pure hybrids are coming in as GSD crosses because nobody is checking to ensure that they dont and I am also sure that many of these will in time be siezed and I wonder what sort of people own them.
Paul

Hi,
I guess the wolfdog is subject to the same hysteria that has grown out of the fear and smear campaigns surrounding the Pit Bull and Bull-type dogs.I have an American Bulldog and know several Staffordshire owners who have been abused for owning "dangerous Dogs",some dogs have even been kicked for walking too close to a persons dog! One story that happened to me was when I was walking my dog he approached a group of people,who he gets treats from,they own small dogs who are not scared of my dog.Well a young Labrador came up and the littles dogs attacked the lab,my dog reacted by joining the chase,but was not being aggro,however one of the little dog owners began to scream and kick at my dog yelling"Get Jas away he's the dangerous one",I got Jas,put him on lead and as I walked away I looked at the owner of the Labrador,who smiled and said"It's okay,it's their fault" and I walked out of the park.I didn't take Jas back for 3 weeks and everyone who knows me and Jas said they missed us-cos Jas is the life of the party.
Peoples perceptions of certain dog breeds will never change or will be manipulated by stories,myths,legends and the media in particular are guilty of exaggerating things the only thing we,as rare breed owners can do is ensure our personal dogs behave BETTER than the other dogs around us and when given the opportunity show that it is not our dog that is the problem,but societies attitudes that are.
Simon

Very True Simon,how do you think I feel with a pack of killer Rottweilers.its hysteria because thats the way the press make it,you are more likely to be attacked by a small dog than a large one,people dont seem to realise that a big dog has nothing to prove,small ones do.
The Pit Bull and American Bulldogs are great dogs in the right hands and that is where the problem lies,currently the AB is the favourite of the drug dealers now they cant legally have pits although I am sure many of the so called cross breeds are.
Paul

The same situation applies here Paul.Although Australian authorities find it harder to take Pitbulls here,it's always the big dogs fault!!This is always going to be the case unfortunately.It's also why I'm keen to impress upon potential Australian importers of the need to really get to know the Wolfdog before they bring them here.It would be nice if the dogs only ended up with good owners but we're dealing with human beings and for the good intentions in the world mistakes will be made.
Simon

I agree about changing the name. When I meet folks on my tracks with my Saarloos Wolfhonds and someone asks what kind of dog it is I tell them it is a Saarloos-dog - not wolfdog. Many sled-dogs also appear wolfish - so people settle with the Saarloos-dog explanation and dont ask more questions. On the other hand: tell them it is a wolfdog and people react very differently.

I would call the Checkoslovakian Woldog simply a VLCAK. It is not a lie and it is the best for everyone. The word WOLF is an inherited (maybe genetic) psycological fear-inducing word. It ranks with the words: SNAKE, GHOST, DARKNESS, DEVIL &.c. This is things people have learned to fear for centuries. Have you ever considered the frequency of real SNAKE-FOBIA - it is a very deep rooted fobia. The wolf-fobia is maybe not as frequent as snake-fobia, but it is very deep-rooted.

Fenris

Hi,

I got my first FABIO calendar with WOLFDOGS,
but called WOLF in year 2002, and i inform about this ex. to Pavel.
I bought mine from Sweden.

-Suski

Hi all,
I looked at the pics and I also believe to see traits of the 'Wolfdog'.
I think this was the original question.

But why on earth would anyone who purchases a Wolfdog, Czech or otherwise, want to obscure what kind of dog they have?? I have a female of 8yrs and a male of 7yrs and when people ask me, I tell them what breed it is; personally I don't give a rats ass about what people think what kind of dog I have; important is, how I think about this breed and how I get along with my Czech. Wolfdogs!! Most of Europe accepts this breed, so please, stand by your Wolfdogs!

Wulfin

Wulfin,
Whilst I agree with your thoughts,the powers that be dont,its not just a UK/Sweden problem as most European countries are starting to ban breeds they dont like and it can happen to the Czech as easily as to the other breeds,a point that needs to be considered.The other thing that always concerns me is have people got the dog for what the dog is or because its called a wolfdog.
Paul

This is turning out to be an interesting discussion. The idea of changing the name of the dog has come up, and honestly I believe that to be a unnecessary. It is true that in the UK authorities, and in particular DEFRA have a certain aversion to the term wolfdog but there is a reason for this:

“When I say ‘Cocker Spaniel’, you have a good idea of the dog I mean. You know what it looks like, and unless the animal is badly bred, you have an idea of what the temperament is like. There is currently no ‘breed standard’ for wolfdogs.”

Those few phrases, which come from the source (Living with Wolfdogs, by Nicole Wilde) cited by DEFRA as the main reason why wolfdogs are not allowed in the UK. If I was a policy maker and I read those lines I would certainly not want to endanger my constituents by bringing them into contact with such unpredictable animals.

A written statement from the author of those lines recognizing that the situation is different with established breeds (such as the Czecoslovakian wolfdog or the Saarloos) would go a long way to convince them to change their minds. It might be worth a shot. Then again perhaps I just have just grown too attached to these furry monsters my wife keeps at home and insist on calling them by their name.

To bring the discussion back on track though, what bothered me the most was the misrepresentation of wolfdogs as wolves. For one, the people who buy the calendar can feel cheated. Who wants an apple when they pay for a pear? But what is more, misrepresentation of wolfdogs as something they are not (in this case wolves) simply brings the possibility of having some misinformed policy maker banning or restricting these our wolfdogs. That is why I think that when a misrepresentation of this kind happens, someone should do something about it. My main question would be *who* should do *what* about this?

Thank you for that information,I have emailed Nicole to see if she would be prepared to help us.
Paul

Very true. We do not discuss here change of name of the breed, but the crazy Italian guy, who sells false wolf calendars with pictures of Czechoslovakian wolfdogs.


Here I agree with you too. I bought two Czechoslovakian wolfdogs, I am a breeder myself, and I keep on presenting them as Czechoslovakian wolfdogs. Anyone who asks me, gonna get real answer - yes, this is Czechoslovakian wolfdog, no husky, no German shepherd, no malamute, no cross.. I am proud for the breed from my country of origin and as such I will present it. If somebody does not like it, his problem.

In Czech language, we call them Ceskoslovensky vlcak. Not everyone is able to say that. That´s why in other languages they are wolfdogs, chien-loups, cane lupo etc. If UK has a problem with calling CSW´s wolfdogs, well, they can change the name over there. In CR we are proud to have wolfdogs and we gonna keep their name as it is! Btw, Czech word "vlcak" means also wolfdog .. just in Czech republic "vlcak" are very often called all German shepherds too. Maybe that´s why people do not jump up to tree branches, when meeting CSW.

In Czech republic, other breeds than CSW´s are considered as "dangerous". Those are for example rotweilers, dobermans, pitbulls, bullteriers but also akita inu, tosa inu and others. At the same time, the annual statistics show, that most bites people received by German shepherds and tekkels! But of course, those are not "dangerous" breeds and never will be. So it is all just about the owners of the dogs, as usual.

Mirka

Oh and by the way, to the original topic, I got an e-mail from Italy today, from a friend. She says:

Hi Mirka, I red the english forum on wolfdog.about the calendar by Mister Fabio Liverani...and yes..they are wolfdogs...most of them come from the Italian Kennel "Passo del Lupo" ( or the totally of them but I'm not sure about that). There was also the 2004 ediction. In Italy is not a secret for wolfdogs owner tha they are wolfdogs and not wolves....but not for all....

So hmmmmmmmmm :D


Mirka

ok, I sent an e-mail to the guy who produces these calendars. I don't speak french, so I don't know what'll come of it.

Wulfin

Here's the answer I got:

sorry my english is very terrible...

I take a picture wolf in Serra mazzoni, near modena, emilia romagna region
italy.

in "allevamento" name: passo del lupo

my best regards

fabio liveraani

Seems to me this guy doesn´t understand, what is the difference between real wolf and Czechoslovakian wolfdog. Alevamento "Passo del Lupo" means kennel Passo del Lupo, geez!
Can one have registered kennel for wolves? I guess not!
Mr. Liverani clearly feels O.K. taking pics of wolfdogs and naming them wolves. But that´s huge misrepresentation.

Mirka

It seems a hopeless case not worth taking any further action....:twisted: Besides, God knows how the rumours about the wolf/CWD calendar would affect DEFRA and the case of CWDs in the UK...

The photograph knows very well that they aren't wolves : two years ago some people in Italy protested against him and with the editor, but there was no response by the editor. Liverani said the they are like wolves so there is no difference for who see the calendar :evil:

Name of breed: why don't call it "ChildrensLoverDog" ? nice, isn' t it ? :mrgreen:

I really don't think name will make difference...everybody remeber the stupid rules to bring even an adult dog (ov every breed) in UK.

Hi
so it is simply making people fools!
But in my opinion the problem is not a photograph - lier but a problem is in kennel Passo del Lupo and its owner! His dogs, his photos, his fault!

In Poland people are not afraid so much of name "wolfdog", of course SOME PEOPLE ARE afraid of any big dogs, but here people have much respect for wolfs and we (CsV owners) can only be proud of our dogs!
bye
Ela

Thank you very much for this information Wulfin, I find it to be very revealing. My only question now is do you people want to do something about this?

Ori, I think we don’t have problems with the acceptance of the breed in Poland or with the term “wolfdog” also due to the Polish language semantics. The root of the word WILK (pron. vilk), which means a wolf, is present in WILCZUR (pron. ‘vil-tchoor) – an Alsatian , i.e. popular name for GSD. That’s why nobody reacts hysterically to CWD - CZ. WILCZAK (pron. ‘vil-tchak) which sounds even milder and less threatening than ‘wilczur’…. If GSDs have popularly been called WOLSATIANS in Eng. instead of Alsatians for over a hundred years or so, the acceptance of the CWD breed would probably be now much easier in the UK.... :)

Yes, mr. Liverani make money fooling people, I too sent him an email (a couple of month ago) asking why he is selling CZW photos as wolf photos, but got no answer.
May be that one way to change his mind is to contact some international sites like Monty Sloan's and other ("//members.aol.com/wolfpark/") asking them to publish a note on this fraud. Another one (may be) is to contact "Passo del lupo" (www.passodellupo.com) making Fabio aware that in this way he is doing a damage to the breed. Btw Fabio is one of the counsellor of italian czw club and may be he is sensitive to this problem.

ciao

First of all I too agree that this Liverani should change his way of working.
Let me understand something though.
A man comes to your kennel and asks you if he can take photos in order to make a calendar.
He pays you some money for the photos.
He calls the calendar WOLVES.
Should you be blamed for this?
I do not think so.
Some friends of mine used a wonderful CZW in a film, he was interpreting a wolf.
I don't know if in the end titles it will be written : the wolf is not a real wolf, it is a CZW. But if the titles do not show this, are my friends to be blamed?
I do not think so.
A girl met me on the street and asked me if she could make some photos of my dogs. She said she was making a "pictural fable" and needed a photo of a wolf for little red riding hood.
She changed the fable becase she chosed this photo:
http://www.wolfdog.org/ita/gallery/pic19757.html
and put two wolves instead of one.
I saw the "pictoral fable" and she didn't mention that the wolves are really CZW.
Is it my fault?
I do not think so.
The CORRECT behaviour would be to specify WOLF is not = to WOLFDOG.
But if the producer of calendar or films do not do it, the owner of the wolfdog is not to be blamed (I think).

Hmm. If a man comes to my kennel and asks me to take photos of my dogs in order to make a calendar, then of course I want to have a written contract about such a thing. Or at least I ask questions first.
And if I am not totally stupid, I do ask what kind of calendar it is. And if the guy tells me he calls the calendar WOLVES, or that he intends to make calendar of WOLVES, then I explain him straight the dogs in my kennel are no wolves. :evil:
And if he is not gonna call the calendar Czechoslovakian wolfdogs, then he won´t take a single picture in my kennel. No matter how much money he offers.

So to me it seems, that it is very hopeless to write to kennel Passo del Lupo, because the breeder of course knows, where the pics of his dogs go and what Liverani is doing with them. He would have to be big fool not to know! But of course, he gets income from that, so why he would not do that, some people are more after money than others.. :|

I think, Passo del Lupo is to be blamed to cooperate with Liverani on making fake calendars of "WOLVES". But of course, it is first of all Mr. Liverani who misrepresents our breed.

Mirka

I respect your opinion Mirka,
I see the case the same as the other examples I quoted, not so different.
Maybe Passo del Lupo has many faults to be blamed of, but this one is, in my opinon, marginal compared to the fault of Liverani himself.
If he came to me, I would oblige him to write on the calendar that they are not real wolves but wolfdogs.
This Liverani was contacted years ago from one of the people of our italian forum.
He said it was not a documentary calendar but an "artistic" calendar so it was not so important if the wolves were real or not.
He knows very well they are not real wolves, but as it's easier to take photos of woldogs in a kennel than wolves in wildlife....he took the shortest way!
Massimo

Well, Mr. Liverani has his own site (www.fabioliverani.com) and in the site there is a presentation of his activities and his customers:
Some of this customers are abroad, as the english Natural Picture Library, others are in Italy.
He says too that he teams with Sandro Bassi (he put the photos and Bassi put the text) which works in Emilia Romagna's Forest Service.
Sandro too has a mail address.I've found this informations only using internet, I don't know personally none of them.
If it is so important to make him stop this we can write email to his customers (sending him a carbon copy to make him aware that we don't like his fraud) denouncing his non-deontological behaviour (not to say fraudolent).
I first don't like his behaviour, but the real problem is how much damage is he really doing to the breed.
In Italy I don't think so much and I don't know how much he sells abroad, so may be that we make much noise for nothing.

Ciao